Aliens (1986)
This podcast episode critically examines the cinematic prowess of James Cameron, particularly focusing on the film "Aliens." W assert that this movie exemplifies a remarkable shift from the suspenseful horror of its predecessor, "Alien," into a robust action narrative, thereby establishing a unique identity within the franchise. We delve into the thematic elements and character dynamics, noting the film's exploration of corporate greed and human folly in the face of existential threats. Furthermore, we reflect upon the notable performances, particularly that of Sigourney Weaver, and the film's lasting impact on the science fiction genre. Our discourse also addresses the pacing and structural concerns that arise, ultimately leading to a nuanced appreciation of Cameron's work, despite its apparent excesses.
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Transcript
The other thing that I picked on this time around, I was like, oh, that's.
Speaker A:There's nothing anymore.
Speaker A:That's an original idea, which I already knew, but I was like, man, James Cameron had the cyber truck 40 years before Elon Musk.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah, this thing rolls up.
Speaker A:I'm like, dude, if Elon wanted to actually make the cybertruck, we just make it like that.
Speaker B:Welcome to the what's Already podcast.
Speaker B:We fashion ourselves Cinemat judge and jury.
Speaker B:My name is J.J. crowder.
Speaker B:I'm here with co host Alec Burgess.
Speaker A:Let's get it.
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Speaker B:But yeah, we are in week three of James Cameron movies.
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Speaker B:And look for that.
Speaker B:That'll start in March.
Speaker B:So yeah, that'll be fun.
Speaker B:And with that, we're doing Aliens.
Speaker B: ,: Speaker B:It was written and directed by none other than James Cameron.
Speaker B:It stars Sigourney Weaver, Michael Bean, Carrie Hen, Paul Reaser, Lance Henriksen, Bill Paxton, William Hope, Jeanette Goldstein, Mark Ralston, Al Matthews.
Speaker B:And this is another one of these movies that, as is typical with James Cameron, I could just keep going and going.
Speaker B:So I'm going to stop there.
Speaker B:But decades after surviving the Nostromo incident.
Speaker B:Eleanor, please sent out to re establish contact with a terraforming colony who finds herself battling the alien queen.
Speaker B:And her offspring.
Speaker B:It'll work.
Speaker B:This is my movie.
Speaker B:Finally.
Speaker B:Movie.
Speaker B:A good movie that I don't have to be like, I can't believe I have to watch this.
Speaker B:Yeah, I picked it.
Speaker B:Two reasons I picked this one.
Speaker B:When I think of James Cameron movies, there's like four movies that I think of and only three of them I actually give a about and, and want to watch.
Speaker B:And two of them are on this list.
Speaker B:I guess there's five now because of Avatar.
Speaker B:But yeah.
Speaker B:So I think of this one because this is another situation where, listen, Alien is one of my favorite movies of all time, the original.
Speaker B:And I always get a little worried when they bring in someone new or a whole new team to do a sequel.
Speaker B:But this one is arguably as good as the first.
Speaker B:I don't think it's better because it's so different, but it's arguably as good from a different perspective of how to take these movies.
Speaker B:And then the other one is.
Speaker B:One of the other two is on the list that we're gonna be doing next week.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:And then the last one that I always think of is Terminator.
Speaker B:Oh, well, both of them, I guess.
Speaker B:But I. Yeah, the first two I consider standalone from the rest of the hot garbage that's been put out since those two.
Speaker A:Huh.
Speaker A:I said that's fair.
Speaker B:That's fair.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So yeah, Aliens.
Speaker B:I.
Speaker B:This movie is such a wild.
Speaker B:Like, I don't know.
Speaker B:Listen, we know it takes place in the same universe.
Speaker B:It has a lot of the same people while meaning it has Sigourney Weaver and Ripley and the aliens, but other than that.
Speaker B:And I am sorry I sound like, I mean, you're gonna hear some nasty coming out of me.
Speaker B:I'm sick.
Speaker B:So I apologize in advance.
Speaker B:So, yeah, like, but it, it's so wildly different from the first because the first one is just this like suspense horror, like edge of your seat.
Speaker B:Barely see the alien, but God damn, when you do, it's so good, it's tight, it shots because it.
Speaker B:You don't have to worry about seeing just terrible effects given the, the system.
Speaker B:Well, this one James Cameron picks up and is like, we're gonna turn this into a full on Terminator in space.
Speaker B:Basically.
Speaker B:Like it's an action movie and we get everything that goes with it.
Speaker B:What I love about it is that it's like this gritty action movie and you know, it's, it's kind of like Avatar without the nice blue people.
Speaker B:You know what I mean?
Speaker B:You got the space suits, you got the big ass guns, you got, you Got the mechanical walking, like it's just dope.
Speaker B:And it, it is a, a big transition from the styling.
Speaker B:Like I said, it goes into more of like a sci fi action.
Speaker B:But man, it's got some great dialogue, it's got comedy like in the lines that it's there, but it's still very intense.
Speaker B:Like there's still some serious moments.
Speaker B:And then, you know, there's the typical James Cameron Mc Plot, McGuffins where people make stupid decisions for good choice reasons or whatever.
Speaker B:But like, like the whole Newt situation and like you can't help but.
Speaker B:And then it leads to a cliffhanger that wasn't meant to ever be a cliffhanger, but this was supposed to be the end of the damn thing.
Speaker B:But anyway, I, I just really like it because it's a unique, I think, movie in cinema history because of the way that it shifted genres from this movie and yet still found a way to be just as good as the first one, in my opinion.
Speaker B:And, and taking that and being able to run with it now after this we get a little wonky and some sketchy weird going on and then we just go off the rails completely down the road.
Speaker B:But this was a very good sequel and very interesting and very different than I, I think anybody expected when they said they were doing a sequel to Alien.
Speaker B:So that's why I picked it because this is primo James Cameron to me before his head got too big for his britches and he was still figuring out doing weird that Hollywood wasn't prepared for.
Speaker B:And I really like what he did with this film.
Speaker B:So that's why I picked it.
Speaker B:What about you, man?
Speaker B:I can't imagine that these are films that you're like, no, I'll watch Alien.
Speaker A:No, not even a little bit.
Speaker A:So this was the first time I'd seen, oh, front to back in one sitting.
Speaker A:Like I'd seen the entire movie several times because a 40 year old movie, it's been around for a long time, but I never sat down start to finish.
Speaker A:I'd always catch the beginning where you got, you know, they're, they're looking for the colony or I catch the end of it, or I catch a little bit in the middle, but I never sat down and watched it front to back.
Speaker A:And so my introduction, my first introduction to the Aliens universe was one that they did a handful of years ago, Prometheus.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Is that was the introduction to.
Speaker A:And that's a weird one.
Speaker A:And so I was like, huh.
Speaker A:And then I, I can't watch Alien all The way through.
Speaker A:Because it's terrifying.
Speaker A:Yeah, it is nasty and gross and disgusting.
Speaker A:No, thank you.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker A:And so coming into this, I haven't, like, an idea of it.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:But this is a movie that I can watch because, like you said, it doesn't necessarily fit into the previous theme.
Speaker A:It's a sequel.
Speaker A:Carry on.
Speaker A:We have all the same components put together or the same pieces in play.
Speaker A:But it's not the suspenseful, scary what's happening going on.
Speaker A:In fact, it's.
Speaker A:Sometimes it's even a little comedic when they start running like the Basilisk that runs on water.
Speaker A:It cracks me up.
Speaker A:And then the other thing that I picked on this time around, I was like, oh, that's.
Speaker A:There's nothing anymore.
Speaker A:That's an original idea, which I already knew, but I was like, man, James Cameron had the cyber truck 40 years before Elon Musk.
Speaker B:Rolls up.
Speaker A:I'm like, dude, if Elon wanted to actually make the Cybertruck, could we just make it like that?
Speaker A:Yeah, that's the truck everybody wants.
Speaker A:But that thing rolled up, and I was like, oh, man, are you kidding me?
Speaker A:But it was good for.
Speaker A:For watching it for the first time where, like, I. I understood a little bit about what happened.
Speaker A:And the only part that really kind of throws me for a loop is the.
Speaker A:And it's.
Speaker A:It's almost like a James Cameron thing that he puts it is the bad guy who is, you know, trying to sneak an alien through quarantine.
Speaker A:And this mission isn't actually as, you know, sanctioned as it's thought to be.
Speaker A:And it's more of a personal thing for him.
Speaker A:It's the.
Speaker A:The thing that baffles me about it is that it's a James.
Speaker A:That's why I think it's a James Cameron thing is that the point of it doesn't make sense because you get into the actual colony and there's a face hugger that's still alive in a little container.
Speaker A:Just take that if you're so concerned about it.
Speaker B:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:But the whole, like, oh, I'm gonna sneak it past Quart Team by having it inside Ripley and Newt, then I'll just hash it on the other side.
Speaker A:I was like, dude, what?
Speaker A:Because you can still do the entire plan your way.
Speaker A:Just take the Face hugger that's already contained.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And so.
Speaker A:But that's.
Speaker A:That's a very.
Speaker A:Almost James Cameron S type thing.
Speaker A:So, you know, it's like, okay, yeah, I get where you're coming from.
Speaker A:But at the same time, like, this bad guy's Kind of lame.
Speaker B:Sucks.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Just keep the aliens as the bad guys.
Speaker B:They're much better at it for sure.
Speaker B:I. I won't lie.
Speaker B:I think that's one of my biggest issues with the Alien franchise, if you will.
Speaker B:Is that like, you know, the Otani Corporation or whatever, like their whole thing, the whole time is like, we want to capture these aliens and be able to reproduce them and use them.
Speaker B:And I'm like, okay, hold on.
Speaker B:Like, look, I get it maybe this time, right?
Speaker B:And there's also, I mean, if you get into the whole world of, of Alien, there there's like, there's some timeline issues.
Speaker B:So not many people know exactly the whole timeline of this whole thing.
Speaker B:It's a little wonky, but I just look back at every time they try to run a mission outside of the first one, which is just a happenstance.
Speaker B:Oops.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:But from then on, like, it's all about getting the alien genome or bringing the alien back a live specimen or something so that they can study it, recreate it, whatever.
Speaker B:And I'm like, listen, I get it.
Speaker B:In a lot of cases, like, there's going to be a lot of things where you're like, oh, that would make us a lot of money.
Speaker B:We'd be the military applications, the, you know, whatever.
Speaker B:This is not it.
Speaker B:Like there's a point where you're like, okay, fine, the Nostromo, it was a one off thing.
Speaker B:There were like eight people on it.
Speaker B:How are they gonna defend themselves?
Speaker B:It was a mining shit, like, whatever.
Speaker B:But after this particular incident and you get there and this entire colony is like gone toast, except for Newt, who's able to hide in weird places and get.
Speaker B:You know what I mean.
Speaker A:Don'T.
Speaker B:And then you send in a pack of marines.
Speaker B:And these guys are no joke.
Speaker B:Like, I mean, listen, Bill Paxton in this movie is one of my favorite characters of Bill Paxton's of all time.
Speaker B:Like, I love Bill Paxton, rest his soul.
Speaker B:But like, man, these guys in like Michael Bean, like, I love this crew, right?
Speaker B:And they get their asses handed to them like it's nothing.
Speaker B:And that's what the aliens do, right?
Speaker B:That's these, the aliens in these movies are always just other than Sigourney Weaver and Ripley, one step ahead and they just crush because they're just four legged wrecking balls, right?
Speaker B:And yet we try.
Speaker B:We just keep.
Speaker B:Why there has to.
Speaker A:This time it'll work.
Speaker B:Yeah, like I.
Speaker B:And I think that's part of the problem I have with it just continually going on and on and on as I'M like, guys, you have learned this is not a species to be with.
Speaker B:You're knocking.
Speaker B:Even if you were able to get a.
Speaker B:Or be smart and take a live face hugger or smuggle an alien out in these two human beings, what are you gonna do?
Speaker B:All it's gonna happen is bye bye Earth or bye bye colonies or.
Speaker B:Because as soon as these sons of start reproducing and you're.
Speaker B:At least one of them is gonna wipe some out, let alone a whole pack of them.
Speaker B:And the, the acid for blood.
Speaker B:Like there's no practical application for these creatures.
Speaker B:None.
Speaker B:Because you can't control them.
Speaker B:I don't give a what you do.
Speaker B:You're not controlling this, this kind of alien.
Speaker B:These things have one purpose and that is two pure purposes.
Speaker B:Eat and reproduce.
Speaker B:That's it.
Speaker B:Like so I always am a little.
Speaker B:That's the one thing.
Speaker B:But for this one and, and the first one, it works because the first one, this incident happens, the second one, they're like, wait a minute.
Speaker B:But then after, it may be fine.
Speaker B:You could have like Aliens 3 right where it's.
Speaker B:That one even fits in the timeline.
Speaker B:It's not nearly, it's.
Speaker B:It's an inferior movie to these first two, but it's not horrid and it makes sense because that's the first time you get to see true wholesale slaughter in massive numbers besides like off screen stuff.
Speaker B:But I just like, it blows my mind that these people just keep trying and I, so I think that's one of my things.
Speaker B:But other than that, like I love this movie.
Speaker B:It's got pretty much anything I could want from a mindless, entertaining perspective to you know, an action film turn slightly and it, I think they could have ramped up the intensity.
Speaker B:But when you, when you change the venues and the amount of aliens you got and then that at the Marines, you're not on a ship with like an air pistol.
Speaker B:Basically.
Speaker B:Like you're on a, you got, you got equipment.
Speaker B:You gotta have more than one.
Speaker B:So I, I really liked it.
Speaker B:I, I think the acting for what it is and the, and the effects.
Speaker B:This is another thing James Cameron does, right?
Speaker B:Like he took the one part that they had a hard time with in the original Alien movie is how do you make this thing look scary with a human inside of it, right?
Speaker B:Like inside the, the costume.
Speaker B:And, and the answer to that in the seventies was you don't.
Speaker B:You keep it off screen and you just show bits and pieces and silhouettes and just the face or whatever and that.
Speaker B:Because even the little One that pops out of the dude's chest.
Speaker B:You're like, that looks a little goofy.
Speaker B:But he took this one and he's like, oh, no, we're gonna have some aliens and these are gonna look scary and move and it.
Speaker B:Like you said, except with a run across water then.
Speaker B:But yeah.
Speaker B:So kudos, James Cameron, for upping the crazy look volume like for this movie from the first.
Speaker A:I'll say.
Speaker A:So watching it, there was something that I was thinking of.
Speaker A:I was like, I wish I could.
Speaker A:This would have happened because they almost lean into it.
Speaker A:But again, this is an 80s action film, so it is very surface level.
Speaker A:Big guns, big explosions.
Speaker A:That's what it was meant to be.
Speaker A:That's what it was.
Speaker A:That's.
Speaker A:That's where we're going.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:But they set it up so nicely for this almost like secondary plot when they first send the Marines in.
Speaker A:And it's like, oh, hey, guess what?
Speaker A:You guys actually need to collect everybody's max.
Speaker A:You can only have fire.
Speaker A:Right?
Speaker A:Like, you can't.
Speaker A:You can't actually use the weapons that you brought in.
Speaker A:And then, you know, you have a commander who is not experienced.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:It's like the second time or whatever, he's running a landing and he's only done simulations.
Speaker A:Like, he has no real meaningful combat experience.
Speaker A:Like you, you have this potential for a complete setup from the beginning and they don't lean into that.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:As much as I would have liked to see.
Speaker A:Because then it kind of would make sense when you have your sponsor being this guy who's trying to get a specimen, it's like, oh, yeah, you know, by the time they figured out that, no, it's a crack Marine squad, sure.
Speaker A:But the commander is a, you know, no experience.
Speaker A:He doesn't know what he's doing.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Now on top of that, you know, oh, here's, here's another reason we're going to send the Marines who are going to be the biggest issue I have in getting this thing back to Earth.
Speaker A:We're going to send them in without their full equipment.
Speaker A:And you have the ability to connect these little dots and have it be this.
Speaker A:You know, I need Ripley because she knows what's going on.
Speaker A:I need the Marines to get me one.
Speaker A:But I need to make sure they don't survive while they're doing it.
Speaker A:And I need a commander that's going to make it look like it was his fault.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:I need a fall guy.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And so that's why when I was watching, I was like, oh, little connection.
Speaker A:But that's watching it from, you know, now.
Speaker A:Now we have a little bit more of when a movie has this plot than secondary thing.
Speaker A:When they were making this, they were like, we're making a sequel.
Speaker A:It's going to be explosions and giant mechs.
Speaker A:And, you know, that kind of.
Speaker A:And it's.
Speaker A:It's still enjoyable.
Speaker A:But while I was watching, I was like, oh, this would have been so sweet if you just went there.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:That whole underlying.
Speaker B:Well, and I think that's the other problem, that they lean a lot more into the corporate espionage type later films.
Speaker B:And you're right.
Speaker B:Like, I think it would have made an even better subplot with this one.
Speaker B:And especially, like, if they find out a little better or easy.
Speaker B:You know what I mean?
Speaker B:Like, if it doesn't.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker B:If it's not, like, just brushed over, then I. I think.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So I think it's a good call out.
Speaker B:I think it's a good call out.
Speaker A:Because you need a reason to hamstring your Marines.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Because.
Speaker A:But at the same time, the reason is.
Speaker A:Oh, acid.
Speaker A:Acid.
Speaker A:Or, you know, you're.
Speaker A:You're in a spot where you can't hit a tank or whatever because it all goes.
Speaker A:Bluey.
Speaker A:Most Marines would be like, well, why don't we just come back out and Bluey.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Like, problem solved.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Well, we go to save the colony.
Speaker B:No, you don't.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:No, rebuild that.
Speaker A:The colony's done.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:There's nothing to be salvaged, my friend.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And Ripley knows it.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And I mean, the biggest red flag in this is when they see everybody bunched up and they're like, oh, let's go check out why they're all hanging out there.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Like, dude.
Speaker A:Well.
Speaker B:And I think there's, like.
Speaker B:There's one line in this movie that, like, really, like, epitomizes the Marine crew.
Speaker B:And that's where Ripley's like, did IQs just drop while I was away?
Speaker B:I'm like, yeah, apparently they did.
Speaker B:Which, I mean, adds another level to your.
Speaker B:I mean, these are a crack Marine squad, but they're not the brightest on the.
Speaker B:No in.
Speaker B:You know what I mean?
Speaker B:Bulbs in the.
Speaker B:In the box.
Speaker B:Which I suppose sometimes works out in the favor of what you're looking for there.
Speaker B:But it also works out from a perspective of nobody's gonna figure out your secret plot to get anybody because they're just grunts.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Like, But I love their banter, dude.
Speaker A:Like, it's so great.
Speaker B:Oh, my God.
Speaker B:It's so.
Speaker B:Like, when.
Speaker A:Freaking vasquez.
Speaker A:Is my favorite.
Speaker B:Oh, she's amaz.
Speaker B:Serious.
Speaker B:Well, like, when Paxton's like, anybody ever acute, like, mistake you for a man?
Speaker B:Anybody do the same for you?
Speaker B:It's just like.
Speaker A:Just right off the cuff.
Speaker B:She's the best dud.
Speaker A:Had them locked and loaded.
Speaker B:Oh, God, yeah.
Speaker B:The two of them.
Speaker B:You got Michael Bean just being Michael Bean.
Speaker B:Serious.
Speaker B:And like, it just.
Speaker B:It's such a good, good crew.
Speaker B:I love it.
Speaker B:And then it's.
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:The other staple that runs through the alien movies is the androids, right?
Speaker B:And you have Bishop in this one.
Speaker A:Who.
Speaker B:I listen, Bishop's Bishop.
Speaker B:And he was there for, I think, the next two or three outings of this particular thing.
Speaker B:And then he, you know, turns out he's a recreation.
Speaker B:There's a whole lot of that goes on with Bishop, but I don't know.
Speaker A:It'S kind of go bad.
Speaker B:What's that?
Speaker A:Don't they kind of go bad or.
Speaker A:Because there's something in Prometheus where that.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Droid fight or whatever and the Ron Android got back on and.
Speaker B:Yeah, the droids are always.
Speaker B:The androids are always the.
Speaker B:There was a weird spot in these movies, like, especially the Bishop versions, right.
Speaker B:Like, so, like the Lance Hendrickson, because he's.
Speaker B:He's good and then he's not.
Speaker B:And then he's based on, like.
Speaker B:He's like a recreation.
Speaker B:Kind of like our Android version of, like, the tiny corporation head of something at some point, like, is one of the story lines.
Speaker B:And so he has, like, some of the same thought processes.
Speaker B:So they're always a little on the morally gray aspects, I think I keep.
Speaker A:I don't.
Speaker B:Struggling to remember it, which I should.
Speaker B:I'm embarrassed that I can't remember his name.
Speaker B:Ian Holm, who plays the one in the original Ash, he was good.
Speaker B:As good as an Android can be.
Speaker B:But I think that's.
Speaker B:The other part is, like, the androids have always represented, like, the neutral party in.
Speaker B:In these films to a certain degree in most cases, with the exception of, like, Prometheus, where Michael Fassbender.
Speaker B:His has always been an.
Speaker B:Like, he was always sent to figure out the alien or, you know, the cradle of creation type.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:But, like, when it comes to Bishop and Ash and, like, how those.
Speaker B:And then they're a little different in that they come back, they do weird things.
Speaker B:So they always kind of that morally gray piece, like, that's.
Speaker B:They understand the need to destroy the alien, but they also have this directive that they're supposed to, like, help save it.
Speaker B:And find a way to, you know, bring some of it home or figure it out.
Speaker B:So it's.
Speaker B:I know it's wonky, but I.
Speaker B:It gets really dumb after this one.
Speaker B:Like, Lance Hendrickson's Lance Hendrickson.
Speaker B:So anytime he's kind of like Stephen Lang back in the 80s, right.
Speaker B:Like, so, yeah, he was the guy that James Cameron's like, I need to have him in these movies because he's awesome and that voice.
Speaker B:But, like, I don't know.
Speaker B:He also, I think, serves to.
Speaker B:And they also, throughout the series, serve to, like, muddy the waters a lot, too, because you're always like, like, I think this movie could have done fine without Bishop.
Speaker B:Like.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:I mean, find it at.
Speaker B:But all it did was.
Speaker B:And I think other than Sigourney Weaver, this was.
Speaker B:The connective tissue was having Sigourney Weaver and another Android in that.
Speaker B:Because Ash played such a big part with Sigourney Weaver in the first one.
Speaker B:And so they were like, well, we'll bring in.
Speaker B:And you.
Speaker B:You know, you have a freaking legend like Ian Holm playing one, you got to have a legend like Lance Hendrickson playing another.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:But I don't think he adds much outside of, oh, there's another Android.
Speaker B:Is he gonna be a good guy or bad guy or somewhere in the middle?
Speaker B:We don't know.
Speaker B:So, yeah.
Speaker A:Makes sense.
Speaker A:All right, I got.
Speaker A:I got one more gripe.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker B:Okay.
Speaker A:And it's.
Speaker A:It's simply because it's a trope that I don't understand, or I understand its use, but it gets overused.
Speaker B:Sure.
Speaker A:And it's the idea that, you know, after.
Speaker A:After they get back to the main base or whatever, and they're taking stock what they have, and they're like, we got three guns, and there's 50 rounds each.
Speaker A:They present.
Speaker A:They then presume to fire these motherfuckers 10,000 times.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And the problem I have with this in this specific scenario is you do not need it.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:You've just seen the hive, the nest.
Speaker A:There's way more of these aliens than these marines have ammo for.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:I don't need this speech about how we got nothing and then just go trigger happy, and there's still some left over for RIPLEY to go and take on the queen.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And so it's like, I get why it's there, but in this situation, I don't need it.
Speaker A:All I need to say is something online stuff.
Speaker A:There's a lot more than we thought there were.
Speaker A:There you go.
Speaker A:Like, yeah, that's enough to understand that we don't have the hardware to.
Speaker A:To win.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:We have to.
Speaker A:We have to run away because we don't have enough to win.
Speaker A:But essentially, it's like we got 200 rounds in a.
Speaker A:In plasma rifles, and then we have a firefight for 30 minutes where they're not careful.
Speaker A:They're not careful.
Speaker A:Others.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And the guns like that, you know, they act like you don't go through rounds, like, in seconds, you know what I mean?
Speaker B:Like, you're going through hundreds of 200 rounds in, like, a couple of trigger pulls and a gun like that.
Speaker A:So when that comes up, I'm just sitting there going, I'm doing the Javier thing.
Speaker A:I was like, 1, 2, 3, 7, 29.
Speaker A:And then apparently there was one gun they left off to the side, and that.
Speaker A:That was Ripley's gun for the end.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:You need something?
Speaker A:I was just cracking up because it's like, it's unnecessary after they've gotten their asses kicked.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Like, if it's beforehand and you want to take stock of everything, all about it, but afterwards, I don't need it.
Speaker A:These guys are clearly outmatched for what they brought.
Speaker A:There's not enough of them.
Speaker A:They don't have enough weapons.
Speaker A:They don't have enough ammo, and they lost half their crew.
Speaker A:I don't need any kind of extra handicap thrown in.
Speaker A:That is then just gonna be no point to it.
Speaker B:Yeah, well, yeah.
Speaker B:And for them to call it out.
Speaker B:So, yeah, like, it's a major, major plot point, quote, unquote, if you will.
Speaker B:So I get what you're saying.
Speaker A:Conserve your ammo.
Speaker A:And then it's just like, say hello to my little friends.
Speaker A:Spraying the vents and everything.
Speaker B:Yeah, well.
Speaker B:And I would do, like, at some point, and I guess they do.
Speaker B:I don't know, like, at some point, like, this last stand thing, just blow the place up, like.
Speaker A:And I.
Speaker B:You know, you're gonna.
Speaker B:And I guess if I'm.
Speaker B:If I'm the Marines, if I'm whatever, there's a point where I go, listen, we're gonna get either way.
Speaker B:Like, so at this point, I'm gonna save all of us, and maybe all of us will go to jail and maybe one of us will go to.
Speaker B:You know what I mean?
Speaker B:Like, we'll get court martial, whatever it is.
Speaker B:But I think I'd rather die to a firing squad or then being eaten by an alien.
Speaker B:Like, you know what I mean?
Speaker B:Like, I'm blowing this up.
Speaker B:Like.
Speaker B:And we have the means to do so very easily.
Speaker B:So I. I think to kind of go along with that.
Speaker B:Like, there's a lot of like serious plot pushing in this movie that you're like, that doesn't make a ton of sense.
Speaker B:But you so easily forgive it because of the action and the funny and the, you know, the well played.
Speaker B:Like the seriously just entertainment that comes from this movie to James Cameron's credit.
Speaker B:Like it is a wildly entertaining movie and so you, a lot of people forgive like those kind of.
Speaker B:I know I do.
Speaker B:Like the silly like what the fuck are we doing here?
Speaker B:Like it's like that guy.
Speaker B:I show you a TikTok, it's like, yeah.
Speaker B:To another episode of what the are you still doing there?
Speaker B:Like it just like this is like the ultimate episode of that.
Speaker B:You walk in, you see that and you're like, no peace.
Speaker B:And if nothing else, I'm blowing myself.
Speaker B:You know what I mean?
Speaker B:Like, we'll blow it up and then I don't know what happened.
Speaker B:Everybody died.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Nuke malfunction.
Speaker B:Yeah, exactly.
Speaker A:Nobody pushed a button.
Speaker A:It just dropped itself.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:It just fell launched.
Speaker B:I don't know what the hell.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:The common sense goes out the window because we have orders they that.
Speaker A:That'S.
Speaker B:Why I could never be a Marine.
Speaker B:I'd question two videos.
Speaker B:I have another gripe and it's a typical James Cameron grape and I bet you can see where.
Speaker B:I bet you know exactly where I'm going with this.
Speaker B:Oh, it's too long.
Speaker B:Yeah, I love it.
Speaker B:And it's not even like a full James Cameron length, but it's over two hours long.
Speaker B:And for movies like movie like this, it's unnecessary and there's a lot of pieces.
Speaker B:As much as I love the dialogue and love like the conversations, there are some slow moving dialogue like the whole.
Speaker B:And I think this is a.
Speaker B:An epitome again I keep saying it.
Speaker B:This is an epitomized version of what we've talked about quite a few times.
Speaker B:This podcast is overdoing something like we just talked about.
Speaker B:We're willing to forgive a lot in this movie because of the entertainment value and how well it looked.
Speaker B: And in: Speaker B:And he did it with this movie impressively.
Speaker B:It's gritty, it's dark.
Speaker B:They use that dark lighting to be able to hide a lot of things like that.
Speaker B:I'm sure if you lit that, that studio room up, that set piece up, it probably looked like cardboard and Styrofoam with paint all over it.
Speaker B:But in the dark, with little flashlights and fast movements, it looks amazing and scary and horrifying.
Speaker B:We forgive a lot because of everything that you did, right.
Speaker B:Stop trying to make this some sort of philosophical, deep movie with all of the closed door conversations and the deep.
Speaker B:All the philosophy I need is when Newt says, mom always told me there were no monsters, but there are.
Speaker B:In Sigourney Weaver's amazing line, yes, there are, aren't there?
Speaker B:Why do you guys say that?
Speaker B:Because most of the time it's true.
Speaker B:And that, to me, is as philosophical as this movie needs to get.
Speaker B:But we start getting into all the different.
Speaker B:What's the right and wrongs of keeping an alien and trying to use an alien and all.
Speaker B:I don't need all that.
Speaker B:It's too much.
Speaker B:All I need to know is they're trying to keep them and we're trying to kill them.
Speaker B:And you've been set up like it.
Speaker B:That's all I need.
Speaker B:And this movie works.
Speaker B:And it could have been an hour and 45 minutes and just as good, if not better, in my opinion.
Speaker B:But it's a James Cameron thing, like we talked about two times already this month.
Speaker B:The guy's got to put everything under the sun in it, or I feel like he feels like he can't walk away from it.
Speaker B:And that, to me, is the.
Speaker B:The biggest issue that he's always had because every one of his movies.
Speaker B:Spoiler alert.
Speaker B:I'm going to talk about this again for next week's movie.
Speaker B:They're too long.
Speaker A:It's just.
Speaker B:They're just bloated.
Speaker B:And this one is one of the shorter ones of his filmography, and it is too bloated.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And I guess for me, it was more of a pacing thing.
Speaker A:That's fair, because at, like, minute 25, we've already, you know, found Ripley, gone to the colony, figured out that the colony's been taken by the aliens and we're not getting them back.
Speaker A:Escaped, lost half the marines.
Speaker A:And then Newt gives this line where it's like, it's getting dark, and that's when they come.
Speaker A:And the movie goes on for two more hours.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:So you hit, like, everything's rapid, quick, and then you have just elongated the rest of it.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And so you.
Speaker B:You're.
Speaker A:You're kind of.
Speaker A:When you're watching it or when I was watching it, I was like, cool pace.
Speaker A:Let's go.
Speaker A:Boom, boom, boom, boom.
Speaker A:We're gonna hit everything And I think hour and a half based on your pacing that you said at the beginning you can still cover everything.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:But then we get a.
Speaker A:A 10 minute sequence in the, you know, medical bay with the face huggers and Ripley and Newt.
Speaker A:And then we have a 30 minute fight scene going through the air vents.
Speaker A:We have an additional 15 minutes of Ripley going after Newton, the queen.
Speaker A:And we have all these extra things that take more time than it took to get two are, you know, first act and through the first act.
Speaker A:So like the first act's 25 minutes long, the second act feels like 25 minutes long, and the third act feels like an hour and a half.
Speaker B:Yeah, that's fair.
Speaker A:It's like you start losing me because then I'm looking at like, dude, this movie should have been done, like, how much?
Speaker A:There's 40 minutes left.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:Because it's that point.
Speaker A:Like the movies should already be completed based on the pacing that you set going into it.
Speaker A:And instead it just keeps on going and going and then the pacing slows down.
Speaker A:Which is never a good thing.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker A:To finish.
Speaker A:Then.
Speaker A:Then you get that bloated.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:You know, stuff going on.
Speaker A:I was like, I was sitting there going, I could have this movie done in 75 minutes.
Speaker B:Yep.
Speaker A:And still told the same exact story.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah.
Speaker B:It's typical James Cameron.
Speaker B:I think the only movie I think of that when I think of James Cameron that wasn't over bloated in some way, shape or form or drag on was the original Terminator.
Speaker B:Like, because that movie just didn't have filler.
Speaker B:It was just off from start to finish.
Speaker B:But from there on, like even Terminator 2, which we did, you know, an episode and we talked about this like it could have been shorter.
Speaker B:You know what I mean?
Speaker B:And it.
Speaker B:But this movie does suffer from James Cameronisms of the.
Speaker B:The bloat and the tumor.
Speaker B:And it's a good call out.
Speaker B:The.
Speaker B:The pacing is wild.
Speaker B:You're like someone slammed the gas from moment one and then all of a sudden we slam on the brakes and we let that idle through the rest.
Speaker B:And it does have some sequencing.
Speaker B:Weird sequencing issues too, in my head.
Speaker B:Like some things take place and I don't.
Speaker B:I don't know, maybe it's because the pacing slows down so bad that it feels that way, but it's just too long.
Speaker A:It is.
Speaker B:It's too long.
Speaker B:It's 30 minutes too long.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:At least.
Speaker B:So.
Speaker B:But Bill Paxton, God, I miss Bill Paxton.
Speaker B:I love him and I love that character.
Speaker B:Should we rate it?
Speaker A:Let's do it.
Speaker B:All right.
Speaker B:My go.
Speaker B:Aliens.
Speaker B:Look, this movie, okay, the original scared the out of me when I was a kid.
Speaker B:One of the worst things, one of the first horror films, suspense films that got me hooked on horror was Alien.
Speaker B:This one to me was like, this is amazing because we got to see what we didn't get to see in the first one, effectively.
Speaker B:And it was awesome and it's amazing.
Speaker B:So there's a lot of nostalgia for me, but I am going to give it a four instead of a five.
Speaker B:Like, I want to give it a five because I love it so much.
Speaker B:But that would be the nostalgia speaking.
Speaker B:It is entertaining, it is fun.
Speaker B:And when they get it right in this movie, God damn, they get it really right.
Speaker B:It's funny, it's action packed, it has tension, it has some interesting storylines woven through.
Speaker B:Even with some of the ones that you're like, I didn't need that.
Speaker B:There are some really dumbass decisions that are made throughout this movie, but I can't say that those aren't true to human nature sometimes too.
Speaker B:And as much as I want to say, why would we keep trying to keep this?
Speaker B:Because humans are stupid and we want to have cool.
Speaker B:We want to say, look, I've got an alien that I can control.
Speaker B:So we're dumb, but it is too long.
Speaker B:It's bloated, it's.
Speaker B:It's too much.
Speaker B:And so for that reason alone, I. I give it a four.
Speaker B:But I would watch this movie anytime.
Speaker B:Like, it has a lot of things that I love.
Speaker B:There are parts that I probably skip past a lot of.
Speaker B:The slow pacing.
Speaker B:Like, I don't.
Speaker B:The face hugger scene in the Latin.
Speaker B:I'm out.
Speaker B:I don't that part.
Speaker B:Give me, Give me five minutes and I'm done.
Speaker B:Right?
Speaker B:And that's all I needed.
Speaker B:But outside of that, like, I just really enjoy this movie.
Speaker B:It's fun action movie.
Speaker B:It was still when James Cameron was young and, and not so full of himself that he just makes whatever he wants to make and he'll take the back half of his life and make a series of five movies that nobody like me wants anyway.
Speaker B:But, yeah, so there it is.
Speaker B:But I, I love this movie.
Speaker B:Four for me, and I'll watch it anytime.
Speaker A:All right, I'm a comment a little bit lower.
Speaker A:I'm gonna do three and a half.
Speaker A:And the reason for the three and a half is that it is a.
Speaker A:It's.
Speaker A:It's pretty much as advertised for me, right?
Speaker A:It's a.
Speaker A:It's an 80s action flick and it does everything an 80s action flick does.
Speaker A:And it doesn't necessarily.
Speaker A:I mean, it's part of a broader story, but it doesn't act like it always.
Speaker A:Like you said, the only tie to the original Sigourney Weaver and an Android and the fact that it's the same alien.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:The same process.
Speaker A:And so you have almost a standalone movie which is just bigger and better than the source material in terms of 80s action, which is very 80s filmmaking.
Speaker A:Just.
Speaker A:We're gonna make it bigger, we're gonna make it better.
Speaker A:More explosions.
Speaker A:Go on.
Speaker A:And so it's great.
Speaker A:It's a great watch.
Speaker A:It's an entertaining watch.
Speaker A:It's an enjoyable watch.
Speaker A:It is bloated, but it's.
Speaker A:It still promises enough explosions and things of that nature that it's.
Speaker A:If you go into this watch, it's purely of its time.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:It holds up extremely well because they were using practical effects.
Speaker A:They were actually building set pieces out of cardboard.
Speaker A:Styrofoam, like you said.
Speaker A:But they're still building it out and making it.
Speaker A:You know, you're.
Speaker A:You're in there, right.
Speaker A:As soon as they're going through the tunnels, I'm in the tunnel with them.
Speaker A:Like, they do a great job bringing you in.
Speaker A:And so for that reason it's enjoyable, but it's still just.
Speaker A:At the end of the day, it's 80s action flick.
Speaker A:Slap it on there.
Speaker A:And I love it.
Speaker A:I'll give it three and a half.
Speaker A:I don't think I'll watch it again just because I don't have the same nostalgia tying me to the Alien franchise, because it terrifies me.
Speaker A:So there's that.
Speaker A:But this is one that I could sit down and watch again.
Speaker A:It's just if I'm gonna watch something bloated, there's plenty of other stuff out there that I'll watch.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:But it is a good movie.
Speaker A:I'll give it three and a half.
Speaker B:Explosions.
Speaker A:Explosions.
Speaker B:Love it.
Speaker B:There it is.
Speaker B:I love it.
Speaker B:Finally.
Speaker B:I didn't have a rage blackout.
Speaker B:It's first time in like seven episodes.
Speaker B:Eight episodes at least.
Speaker B:Jesus.
Speaker B:Yeah, there we go.
Speaker B:That's fun.
Speaker B:Alec, tell everybody where they can find us when we're not running away from aliens.
Speaker A:Happy to.
Speaker A:Best place to find us is on YouTube where you can see our dead, lifeless faces as we're both feeling a bit under the weather.
Speaker A:It's great.
Speaker A:You can just see the first seven weeks of the year.
Speaker A:You can see JJ's rage behind his eyes now.
Speaker A:It's just dead.
Speaker A:Just nothing there.
Speaker A:It's Great.
Speaker A:At what's our verge reviews on YouTube.
Speaker A:Outside of YouTube, best place to find us, like JJ was saying, is on Patreon at what's our Verdict Reviews.
Speaker A:There you guys can get involved in the content creation of the podcast, which includes votes absolutely free.
Speaker A:Just join the Patreon.
Speaker A:You can vote on topics.
Speaker A:We added some real stakes to our, you know, choices.
Speaker A:So if someone loses a month, there's now consequences other than bragging rights.
Speaker A:It's a list of movies that the person who lost does not want to watch.
Speaker A:And we each picked each other's list, so we were able to torture each other with that.
Speaker A:We know each other very well.
Speaker A:Those are available for purchase if you wanted to, you know, throw a little bit of extra spice into everything.
Speaker A:We'll do a bonus episode on that movie that you picked.
Speaker A:But to vote is completely free.
Speaker A:And now that the votes matter, please get on there and vote 100.
Speaker A:The first eight weeks or six weeks of this year have been fantastic because JJ has not stopped yelling.
Speaker A:So get on there.
Speaker A:Vote.
Speaker A:It makes the best contact with content when you do.
Speaker A:Special thanks to our current patrons, Rich and cb.
Speaker A:You guys are amazing.
Speaker A:Thank you for everything that you do.
Speaker A:And thank you for putting in a few topics that were designed specifically, I'm pretty sure, to make sure JJ had a terrible time.
Speaker A:Special thanks to you guys.
Speaker A:And with that, I'll kick it back to the Colossus of Clout.
Speaker A:The King, the crash.
Speaker B:A J.J. that's right.
Speaker B:I will say, Charles, kind of you, though.
Speaker B:He left a comment on one of our recent extra behind the scenes videos with a.
Speaker B:A link to the per.
Speaker B:He says, I got the perfect horror movie for you.
Speaker B:And I watched it.
Speaker B:I watched like the.
Speaker B:The trailer.
Speaker B:Oh, it's going on your full on.
Speaker A:No, no, Charles.
Speaker B:No, no, no, no, no, no, it is.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah.
Speaker A:No, no.
Speaker B:I watched the trailer and went, I don't even know if I want to watch this movie.
Speaker A:No, no, no, no, no, it's.
Speaker B:Yeah, it's.
Speaker B:Oh, I think.
Speaker B:I mean, let me double check to make sure it.
Speaker B:It's what I. Yeah.
Speaker B:Oh, yeah.
Speaker B:Then the movie name is called Dolly.
Speaker A:Oh.
Speaker B:Oh, no.
Speaker B:D O L L Y.
Speaker B:So there you go.
Speaker A:Dolly Parton.
Speaker B:Oh, no, it's not.
Speaker B:It's like those creepy ass.
Speaker A:Oh, no.
Speaker B:It's a big ass person with a doll costume on.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:Yep.
Speaker B:So that one's now on your get list.
Speaker B:It's not on the just the tip, because that would be mean, but it is on the.
Speaker B:The double list.
Speaker B:So if we ever get to you lose a couple, three months in a row.
Speaker B:That one.
Speaker B:That one's gonna be up for grab.
Speaker A:I just can't lose ever again.
Speaker A:That's.
Speaker B:Yeah, you better pick some good.
Speaker B:Anyway, so.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:See, this here's the stakes, ladies and germs.
Speaker A:Is.
Speaker B:Yep, yep, there it is.
Speaker B:So go vote.
Speaker B:And with that, as always, we appreciate you tuning in.
Speaker B:We'll catch you on the next one.
Speaker A:Hasta la vista, baby.
Speaker B:Cinematic.
Speaker A:Ra.
