Gettysburg (1993)
Mattson, Alec and JJ delve into the cinematic representation of the Battle of Gettysburg, as depicted in the film "Gettysburg," directed by Ron Maxwell. The discussion commences with an acknowledgment of the film's length, a staggering four and a half hours, yet the hosts express their admiration for its historical depth and character development. We explore the compelling narrative derived from Michael Shaara's "Killer Angels," which provides a nuanced portrayal of the events and figures surrounding this pivotal moment in American history. Through their analysis, we examine the emotional resonance of the characters, particularly highlighting the dialogues that echo the sentiments of the actual historical figures. Ultimately, this episode serves as a comprehensive exploration of the film's artistic merit and its significant contribution to the understanding of the Civil War narrative.
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Transcript
Did you ever find yourself during this movie getting all, like, jacked up when they're screaming Virginia and like, like, yeah, Virginia.
Speaker B:No, when I think of Virginia, I think of traffic and humidity.
Speaker B:So I don't.
Speaker B:I don't get too dang passionate about it, but no, that's funny.
Speaker B:I forgot that it's been a couple weeks since I'd seen it.
Speaker B:I was like, oh, yeah.
Speaker B:I should have been like, let's go, virgin.
Speaker A:Welcome to the what's up Every podcast we fashion ourselves cinematic judge and Jerry.
Speaker A:My name is JJ Crowder, here with my co hosts, Matt Senheiner, Better Red.
Speaker B:Than Dead and Alec Burgess.
Speaker C:Let's get it.
Speaker A:We appreciate you tuning in.
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Speaker A:And then it helps to grow the podcast, so we appreciate that.
Speaker A:You know what else helps grow the podcast?
Speaker A:Tell your family, your friends about us.
Speaker A:Tell.
Speaker A:I'm gonna say a war historian.
Speaker A:Maybe a Civil War historian this time.
Speaker A:I can't really tell anybody directly involved, so go ahead and.
Speaker A:Yeah, tell a historian about us.
Speaker A:We'll take that.
Speaker C:There's plenty of ghosts of Confederate soldier stories flying around.
Speaker A:There you go.
Speaker A:Yeah, you can find.
Speaker A:But then, Alec, that means they're telling a ghost and.
Speaker C:Yeah, well, you know.
Speaker A:Sacrifices must be made, right?
Speaker C:I'm brave now, jj, we've done a horror month.
Speaker C:I'm brave.
Speaker A:That's right.
Speaker A:That's right.
Speaker A:If you can't tell, we're kicking over into the month of May.
Speaker A:It's time for a new category.
Speaker A:We are kicking off war movies.
Speaker A:We've done a few in the last little while, some other topics, but this one's just straight war movies.
Speaker A:And I know Alec and I both picked some.
Speaker A:Some.
Speaker A:Some challenges, so we'll see how this goes.
Speaker A:But to kick us off, we're starting it off right with Gettysburg.
Speaker A: ,: Speaker A:It was written by Michael Shara, and Ron Maxwell is directed by Ron Maxwell.
Speaker A:Stars.
Speaker A:Look, I'm gonna give a list of names, but this movie is insane with the.
Speaker A:The amount of cast and what's in it.
Speaker A:But I'll go through a handful of names here.
Speaker A:So we got Tom Behringer, Martin Sheen, Stephen Legg, Richard Jordan, Andrew Prine, Cooper Huckabee, Patrick Gorman, Bo Brinkman, Jeff Daniels.
Speaker A:I almost said the wrong Jeff there.
Speaker A:James Patrick Stewart and Kieran Mulroney.
Speaker A: It is: Speaker A:In the northern and southern forces fight at Gettysburg in the decisive battle of the American Civil War.
Speaker A:Yeah, I mean, if we're gonna kick it off, we're gonna.
Speaker A:We might as well kick it off, right?
Speaker A:With all four and a half hours of.
Speaker A:Of Gettysburg.
Speaker A:So, Alec, I believe this was your choice.
Speaker C:This was.
Speaker C:And I originally picked it 110% to be a dick and make you guys sit through a four and a half hour movie.
Speaker C:But while watching it, I was like, fuck yes, I love this movie.
Speaker C:Like, I forget because it's a four and a half hour movie.
Speaker C:That's enough of a.
Speaker C:Like, hey, you know what?
Speaker C:Maybe not.
Speaker B:I think always.
Speaker C:Oh no, this movie is fantastic.
Speaker C:And so I watched it and I was.
Speaker C:I didn't even feel like it was four hours, four and a half hours.
Speaker C:It felt a lot less of a time.
Speaker C:And it's got me so like, you know, up and atom that Oshi and I are actually gonna go to Gettysburg in a couple weeks.
Speaker A:Nice.
Speaker C:So, yeah, a couple weeks from when this episode releases, will have gone to Gettysburg.
Speaker A:Wow.
Speaker B:Well, if nothing else, it was worth it for you.
Speaker C:Yeah, it was.
Speaker C:I mean, I've been to Gettysburg before.
Speaker C:I grew up on the east coast for a little bit, so I went there as I was a kid, but I haven't been in like 10 years.
Speaker C:And so I was watching this and I was like remembering, you know, because they have a wonderful guided tour that when you go there, I was remembering all the stories that happen and we get into some of the fight and I'm like, dude, I texted Oshi because she wants to go to Salem and see witchcraft stuff.
Speaker C:Sure.
Speaker C:I was like, I don't.
Speaker C:I will go to Salem if you go to Gettysburg.
Speaker C:And so yeah, this movie did exactly what it was supposed to do.
Speaker C:Felt right into the Gettysburg trap and it was all started 100% to be a dick.
Speaker C:So there, there's that.
Speaker C:There's my comeuppance that I got.
Speaker A:Nice.
Speaker C:Oh yeah, I love this movie.
Speaker A:Nice.
Speaker A:Well, I'll stick it right back to you and say I love all four and a half hours of this movie.
Speaker A:I was.
Speaker A:If you hadn't put it on the list, I would have put it on the list.
Speaker A:And not to be a dick, but because this is a great movie about a very crazy time in our history and it's very well done and it's based off of a book that's like extremely good.
Speaker A:In fact, it's based on.
Speaker A:Off of one of a trilogy of books that is outstanding.
Speaker A:This one, the one that this one's based off is Killer Angels.
Speaker A:And the other one is the.
Speaker B:I wondered if it was big.
Speaker B:I love Killer Angels.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:One of the only books in school I'd read that I actually like, truly liked.
Speaker B:It was awesome.
Speaker A:Have you read the other two?
Speaker B:I haven't.
Speaker B:I didn't know there was other two.
Speaker B:I should read them now.
Speaker A:Gods and generals in the Full measure.
Speaker A:It's.
Speaker A:It's a.
Speaker A:Gods in general is the first one, Killer Angels is the second, and then the full measure is the last.
Speaker A:And they're all equally fantastic.
Speaker A:Great points of view.
Speaker A:Gods in general starts before the Civil War, so you kind of get General Lee and a couple of other of the.
Speaker A:These generals that you see and even some of the colonels and stuff like that through this movie.
Speaker A:You get to see their start going through West Point and learn the differences as to why the northern generals were considered the smarter generals but got their asses handed to them for two years, two and a half years.
Speaker A:And then you know why General Lee was so good and like, you know, all the different ones that we see here at the end that they talk about that are just amazing.
Speaker A:So interesting book.
Speaker A:And then the full measure is kind of like the wrap up and you should read them if you haven't very good books.
Speaker A:But yeah, I love this movie.
Speaker A:I saw it in high school.
Speaker A:They made us watch, I think my freshman year.
Speaker A:I was like, oh.
Speaker A:And it took like three weeks.
Speaker A:I was like, jesus Christ, this is a long ass movie.
Speaker A:But yeah, it's really good.
Speaker A:And I watched it.
Speaker A:I think if you guys watch it through Amazon, this was like the.
Speaker A:I watched the extended version, which is 20 extra minutes.
Speaker A:Yeah, I was gonna say, oh man.
Speaker B:That means I did too.
Speaker A:Oh, yeah.
Speaker A:It's almost five hours.
Speaker A:I think it's.
Speaker A:It's very long, but very good.
Speaker A:Matt said, I'm sure we know what.
Speaker B:You'Re gonna say, but I mean, yeah, I think you know what I'm gonna say.
Speaker B:Yes.
Speaker B:And now like, is, Is this movie long?
Speaker B:Like, yes.
Speaker B:JJ said, this movie's long.
Speaker B:Multiple times.
Speaker B:This movie's very long.
Speaker B:Like, I don't know what people did when this movie came out in theaters.
Speaker B:Like, it would have been a lot.
Speaker B:Like they needed multiple intermissions.
Speaker B:Like, people don't have time for this in a movie theater.
Speaker B:Like, this day and age.
Speaker B:Like, you got to allocate like almost six hours.
Speaker B:Like, that's a long time.
Speaker B:That being said, this podcast, you know, I'm a sucker for like war movies and I'm a sucker for history.
Speaker B:So like this movie seemed extremely Historically accurate.
Speaker B:And I absolutely appreciated that.
Speaker B:And I think it was.
Speaker B:I read Kayla Angels.
Speaker B:I've read a lot about Gettysburg and like, seeing it come to life and the sheer amount of people that they put in this movie.
Speaker B:I mean, the battle on.
Speaker B:I should remember the hill that they had to hold on the flank.
Speaker A:Little round top, little round.
Speaker B:Yeah, I mean, I always.
Speaker B:I read about it, knew about it, but like, to see it and what their interpretation of it looked like, like, incredible was the acting.
Speaker B:Like, did it feel like I was in Gettysburg and like a part of the crew?
Speaker B:Yeah, like the I.
Speaker B:So it was visually pleasing, well acted, interesting subject matter.
Speaker B:But yeah, it was long.
Speaker B:So I have mixed feelings.
Speaker B:It's not like I.
Speaker B:I didn't enjoy watching it.
Speaker B:It was just when you got kids and you got stuff to do.
Speaker B:Like, I can't.
Speaker B:I just can't sit and watch this movie in one sitting.
Speaker B:So it felt like it took a long time to get through, but it wasn't bad.
Speaker B:Like, I was entertained.
Speaker B:There were parts with the monologue and how they speak back then and things.
Speaker B:You're just like, okay, like, maybe we could just get through that a little bit.
Speaker B:But at the same time, that's just kind of how things were back then.
Speaker B:But I can appreciate it, like, was a well done movie.
Speaker B:They truly felt like, for me, kind of left no stone unturned with what they were trying to tell.
Speaker B:And I think that's hard to do.
Speaker B:Granted, they took a large amount of time to get that done.
Speaker B:So that's the trade off.
Speaker A:I like it.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:I mean, it's.
Speaker A:I think what I like most about this movie, that besides the.
Speaker A:The movie, like actual visuals and all that fun and what it's about.
Speaker A:But, like, I like it because we.
Speaker A:We do talk a lot about movies that we've watched that are based in historical fact, whatever, whether it's, you know, football movies or war movies or any kind of movie that had, like, this is based on a true story.
Speaker A:Like, the thing that I respect about Michael Shara and the fact that they didn't let it be short is the fact that the books, Killer Angels, those three books, are all based on Michael Shah's research and reading of the journals of all these guys.
Speaker A:Like, he went through and read historical records and journals.
Speaker A:And so a lot of the dialogue he took from journals and then put into this movie as back and forth.
Speaker A:Or those monologues like General Lee sitting with in that tent where he kind of is just talking about.
Speaker A:Well, he's got like eight of them.
Speaker A:But any one of his dialogue, like those.
Speaker A:Those monologues that he does, most of them come at least rooted from things that he wrote in his journal that he was feeling during that time.
Speaker A:And then he.
Speaker A:They turned it into dialogue to kind of express, like, how he was feeling.
Speaker A:And that was true for a lot of the major players that we see in this movie.
Speaker A:And, like, it's really interesting to me to think about one.
Speaker A:The differences in people from back then and now because, like.
Speaker A:And they show it very well in the war.
Speaker A:And I think that's what stands out to me the most is, like, you're fighting this war, right?
Speaker A:Like, people.
Speaker A:You're killing each other.
Speaker A:Like, it's.
Speaker A:It's brutal.
Speaker A:It's crazy.
Speaker A:But when there gets to a point when you realize, look, we've.
Speaker A:We've got this in the bag, like you.
Speaker A:We've won, they start helping each other and, you know, picking each other up.
Speaker A:And it's not like they just start.
Speaker A:And I think that it's in stark contrast to the movies that we're doing later in this month because you see that we move into some very brutal wars where there isn't that consideration of the fact that these are human beings.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:And obviously there's a little difference because half these guys knew each other from schools or, you know, it wasn't as.
Speaker A:As a populated country back then as we are now.
Speaker A:But it's, you know, it's just one of those things where that, to me, stands out huge.
Speaker A:Like, the fact that they went over and at the end, it's huge.
Speaker A:Like, it's a really big thing with the one General Hancock, I think, where he's like.
Speaker A:He's sitting there, and maybe it was a Hancock, it was other.
Speaker A:The other guy that Hancock knew from the Armistead, as he's laying there and he's telling these soldiers, they're trying to take care of this guy and like, that, to me, like, that's.
Speaker A:That's wild.
Speaker A:You know what I mean?
Speaker A:Comparatively to how today, like, I don't think you'd see that same kind of consideration, at least in general, right?
Speaker A:Where this.
Speaker A:That was the norm.
Speaker A:Like, it was, hey, look, these are our people, too.
Speaker A:We're just in a cute war.
Speaker B:I think you said it best, right?
Speaker B:Because these many of these guys, they.
Speaker B:The generals especially, they fought with each other.
Speaker B:They were captains when they were younger, and they were literally doing this again.
Speaker B:The only comparison I can come to that is like, the Revolutionary War, when many.
Speaker B:Like George Washington, some of those people fought with the British captains and generals in the French and Indian War, like, earlier than that.
Speaker B:And they knew each other and things.
Speaker B:But you're right, like, obviously, I've never been in a war, but the camaraderie that you build in those moments doesn't really go away clearly.
Speaker B:And I think they showed that quite well in this film.
Speaker B:And when you're fighting your brother, that just happens to live, I don't know, 100 miles from where you lived.
Speaker B:And there's a.
Speaker B:A wee bit of different ideologies, but then you remember that they're still your friend.
Speaker B:That.
Speaker B:That's probably got to be hard to come to terms with, that times when they're fighting because of something that people say they should fight for.
Speaker B:But do they really care about that thing being slavery as much as a few people do?
Speaker B:It's hard to say.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And I think that was a very.
Speaker B:I like that they dove into that aspect because this movie definitely needed.
Speaker B:I mean, there's clear the emotion of the battles and things, but it needed emotional character progression or.
Speaker B:I don't think you literally could have carried anyone for four and a half hours.
Speaker B:And I thought they did that pretty well with a few different stories.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Well.
Speaker A:And I love the.
Speaker A:The Chamberlain brother story, too.
Speaker A:Like, that's just so.
Speaker A:And I love that they made that, like, front and center.
Speaker A:And if you don't know the history of, like, I.
Speaker A:I'm assuming, Alec, you said you've been.
Speaker A:And you're getting ready to go.
Speaker A:I'm assuming Matt said you've been.
Speaker A:I mean, you live very close.
Speaker A:I mean, it's so.
Speaker B:It's only been once and it's been a while ago, but I've been.
Speaker B:I've been to Manassas Battlefield, like, some of the other major battles very often.
Speaker B:And so, like, the vibe.
Speaker B:I mean, it looks pretty similar to Gettysburg in a lot of senses.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Did you ever find yourself during this movie getting all, like, jacked up when they're screaming, Virginia and like.
Speaker A:Like, yeah, Virginia.
Speaker B:No, when I think of Virginia, I think of traffic and humidity, so I don't get too dang passionate about it.
Speaker B:But, no, it's funny, I forgot that it's been a couple weeks since I'd seen.
Speaker B:I was like, oh, yeah.
Speaker B:I should have been like, let's go.
Speaker A:Yeah, Virginia.
Speaker B:Except Virginia was on the wrong side of the battle, so that's probably where I was like.
Speaker A:And they were absolutely on.
Speaker A:No, because that's.
Speaker A:Where was it.
Speaker A:Was it Richmond?
Speaker A:That was the.
Speaker A:Yeah, the Confederate capital.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah.
Speaker A:I don't like I.
Speaker A:It's been a while since we've been there.
Speaker A:Like, I grew, I went there as a kid because I grew up close to there in Ohio, like eastern Ohio.
Speaker A:Like we were very close to Gettysburg and been there a couple times when I was younger and I didn't understand or respect like the scope of that place when I was there as a kid.
Speaker A:Not.
Speaker A: What was it back in, I think: Speaker A:Ish.
Speaker A:Casey's parents drove down from Utah to see us and hang out, spend some time and we loaded up in a van and they.
Speaker A:We drove up and went to Gettysburg with them and.
Speaker A:And as an adult, I had a much bigger appreciation and understanding from of like what that place was.
Speaker A:And it's pretty awe inspiring as an adult to like stand there and still see.
Speaker A:And they've done a really good job of keeping that, keeping that field and, and little and big round tops, like both historically what it was during that time.
Speaker A:And it's wild.
Speaker A:Like that final charge that Lee was just gung ho was they were going to break the center and like, you see like that tree line, you're like, there's no way.
Speaker A:Like, how did you.
Speaker A:You know what I mean?
Speaker A:And so, and it's wild to think about like the success that Robert E.
Speaker A:Lee had and then in that one moment, like the overconfidence of being stuck by this comedy of errors, you know, from different generals doing dumb or not doing what they should have been doing and then making poor choices of not pushing the advance in that first battle of Gettysburg.
Speaker A:So it's just wild that he's just like, no, we've got, we've got the numbers and we, we can do this and makes that one mistake that really just loses them the war.
Speaker A:So it's really wild to me, like.
Speaker A:But yeah, I found it very humbling to stand there and like you especially after reading all the books and everything else.
Speaker A:And it's just like, wow, okay, this is a linchpin of our country's history right here.
Speaker A:One of them anyway.
Speaker A:And so it's, it's pretty wild to be there.
Speaker A:So I'm excited for you, Alec, to get to go and like be there as an adult and kind of hang out and it's cool.
Speaker A:The tours are bitching.
Speaker A:Like, it's.
Speaker A:Yeah, it's wild.
Speaker A:Wow.
Speaker C:I am stoked.
Speaker C:Something that I really liked about this movie as well is I think they did a good job with the Rebel Yale.
Speaker A:Mm.
Speaker C:That keeping that kind of going like, because I remember when I.
Speaker C:One of the last trips I went to Louisville, but we took it.
Speaker C:Or not.
Speaker C:Louisville, Gettysburg.
Speaker C:We took a.
Speaker C:The guided tour.
Speaker C:And he was talking specifically about the rebel yell.
Speaker C:And they have like a speaker where they play it over and they're kind of like, you know, have you close your eyes and kind of.
Speaker C:They give you a visual picture and you have this thing going the way they built this out, things blood chilling.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker C:And to have, you know, beyond.
Speaker C:Beyond the flank.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:Let's put you in Chamberlain shoes on the flank.
Speaker C:And you got smoke going everywhere.
Speaker C:There's no ammo.
Speaker C:You're running low on everything.
Speaker C:Half your dudes are dead and you're hearing nothing but that coming out of the smoke.
Speaker C:I'm packing it in, dude.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And to still make that choice to like.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:To charge down.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Like wild.
Speaker C:No way.
Speaker C:And so I like that they put this.
Speaker C:These, you know, key points in and they make for a great movie, but there's also the history back behind it and they just.
Speaker C:They don't take too much exposition to explain what's going on.
Speaker C:They just let it ride and it fits so well.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker C:Which is amazing.
Speaker A:It's crazy.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:This.
Speaker A:I remember this.
Speaker A:So I was never like a big history guy when I was a kid, but I will say that in high school, when they made me watch this movie, I was not excited.
Speaker A:And I was living in Kentucky at the time, so I was in a neutral state for the war, but very much in the south, you know what I mean?
Speaker A:And like, Kentucky may have been neutral during the war, but when I was a kid, it wasn't quite as neutral as it used to be.
Speaker A:You know what I mean?
Speaker A:Like, they're sure quick.
Speaker A:They were sure quick a lot of times to.
Speaker A:To claim that Confederate legacy and, you know, what would have happened and whatnot.
Speaker A:And that's.
Speaker A:That's a whole different topic that I could go through and talk about.
Speaker A:But I remember not being, like, real thrilled about the fact that we were going to watch this, because I was like, yeah, whatever, I don't care.
Speaker A:But then this movie really kind of turned me on to history and, like, the fact that the Civil War is a very.
Speaker A:It's a very interesting war and there's a lot more to it than what most people.
Speaker A:What was the Civil War about?
Speaker A:Well, it was about slavery.
Speaker B:Sure.
Speaker A:It absolutely was.
Speaker A:But that's far from the only thing that this war was about, really.
Speaker A:Yeah, like, that's.
Speaker A:That's like.
Speaker A:That's the swing and what was used to, you know, to start it and to continue it on and it ended it, which was wonderful and it should have happened.
Speaker A:But at the same time, like, I didn't know.
Speaker A:Like, I always thought as a kid that that's all it was about.
Speaker A:And then you get to learning the history and it's not at all all that it was about.
Speaker A:But, like, then I.
Speaker A:That's when I started reading the books and I read Killer Angels when I was 16 and I was like, this is great.
Speaker A:It was a very hard book to get through when I was 16, but it was really crazy.
Speaker A:And then I read the whole trilogy, and I've read the whole trilogy a couple.
Speaker A:Couple times now.
Speaker A:And I, like, I hadn't watched this movie in years because it's so long, but I was glad that we did because, like, I was reminded of, like, I love the performance of Martin Sheen and him being so soft spoken as General Lee, which, you know, it's known that General Lee was very soft spoken and patient and calm.
Speaker A:But, like, normally Martin Sheen's kind of got this, like, very loud carrying voice that he uses and he just quiets himself down.
Speaker A:And then, you know, all the supporting characters, like, not a big Tom Behringer fan, but he kills it in this.
Speaker A:And then.
Speaker A:Yeah, like, just so many things.
Speaker A:What's.
Speaker A:His face is picket.
Speaker A:Like, I love, like the.
Speaker A:The smile that he gives when he's like, can you take this?
Speaker A:You know, can you take that.
Speaker A:That ridge?
Speaker A:And he just smiles and goes nuts.
Speaker A:Like, yeah, Stephen Lang or whatever.
Speaker A:Yeah, it's just so many phenomenal actors.
Speaker A:Like, names that you read through and you go, holy.
Speaker A:All these people are in this movie.
Speaker A:And you can tell, like, especially in those generals and the leaders.
Speaker A:And I think, honestly at the time, the most unknown dude was Jeff freaking Daniels, which is wild to think about now.
Speaker A:But, yeah, really, really good casting, I think, was the other.
Speaker A:This couldn't have been a cheap movie at the time to make, though, from a set piece standpoint.
Speaker A:Probably very cheap because I know that they did a lot of the filming there in Gettysburg, so it was probably a lot cheaper to do it there than, you know, in a studio and having to build the sets and things like that.
Speaker A:But from a casting standpoint, they probably.
Speaker A:And I don't know, maybe these actors were like, yeah, we'll do this.
Speaker A:But it.
Speaker A:Because it's a commitment.
Speaker A:But there's also a lot of good Civil War movies, and I think this one's the best.
Speaker A:And I love Glory, don't get me wrong.
Speaker A:Like, I think it's phenomenal, but I think this one's the best of them.
Speaker A:But, yeah.
Speaker C:So I will say something that I hate.
Speaker A:Oh.
Speaker C:And it's.
Speaker C:It's.
Speaker C:It's something that I shouldn't hate, because I know it's the way it is.
Speaker A:Sure.
Speaker C:It's the little bit of the extras, because you have a lot of the extras are Civil War reenactors, and they just have fun out there in that Pennsylvania June heat.
Speaker C:And so, like, it's the little bit, the beginning, where you have the villagers, right?
Speaker C:And they're doing, like, the telling the soldiers, like, where have you been?
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:Cattle raids have been happening.
Speaker C:I'm just sitting there going, oh, my God.
Speaker C:Yeah, but that's it, right?
Speaker C:That's the character.
Speaker C:You go to any kind of place on the east coast historical site, and that's everybody.
Speaker C:And they do not break character.
Speaker C:It does not matter what is going on.
Speaker C:Whole place could be burning down and they'll still be in character.
Speaker C:And then it's.
Speaker C:It's funny as well, because, like, when they do the charge off a little round top, you got the union officer in front of the sword.
Speaker C:He's just, like, dancing.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker C:It's like.
Speaker C:It's like, hey, I get it, right?
Speaker C:What he's doing.
Speaker C:He's looking back to make sure his guys are still following them.
Speaker C:But the way he's, like, jumping around, pirouetting down the hill, I'm like, oh, dude, he's having way too much fun.
Speaker A:That's true.
Speaker A:I love how dramatic some of them are, too, shot.
Speaker A:Like the one guy that, like, jumps, it's like, yeah, you're definitely a Civil War reenactor.
Speaker A:And I get for them, like, it's different because they have to do that so that the people that are standing and watching from the outskirts can see people die.
Speaker A:Like, they have to be super dramatic.
Speaker A:But, like, in the movie, it's really funny.
Speaker A:And I love that they use that guy twice because he jumps and then it cuts away, and then like a couple seconds later it comes back and he jumps again.
Speaker A:Like, that was the same guy twice.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So, yeah, there's some of them.
Speaker C:Those couple moments that are in there where you're just kind of like, oh, my gosh, this is so hokey.
Speaker C:They're just being Civil war and actors and just having the grandest old time doing it.
Speaker C:And so a couple of those ones are just, ah.
Speaker C:Because it frequently that's like, comes after a big kind of or during a big moment where you're like, you know, you're getting ready to go, and you're just like, oh, okay, cool.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah, There we go.
Speaker C:That's what I was missing in this.
Speaker A:That's funny.
Speaker A:That's funny.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:There was another one that.
Speaker A:Another moment like that that I was like, oh, God.
Speaker A:I think it might have been one.
Speaker A:Some dude, like, was getting bayoneted or something, and he's, like, doing all this, like, acting all goofy.
Speaker A:I was like, oh, God, get out of here.
Speaker A:But yeah, there's some funny moments where they overact the.
Speaker A:Out of it.
Speaker B:I mean, they didn't quite often or just some of that.
Speaker B:You're just like, all right, well, this made a while ago.
Speaker B:They probably could have been a little bit more buttoned up with the choreography.
Speaker B:But, yeah, I mean, what are you gonna tell old Joe Schmo that's like, this is my shot.
Speaker B:Like, I've been.
Speaker B:I've been reenacting for eight years.
Speaker C:I'm in the movie now.
Speaker B:This is evil.
Speaker A:Have either of you ever been to a Civil War react reenactment?
Speaker A:One of the live ones?
Speaker B:Yeah, I've been to multiple Alec.
Speaker A:You got to try to find a way.
Speaker A:Like, it's wild.
Speaker A:I don't know that they do them that much.
Speaker A:I'm sure they do.
Speaker A:Look, I say that, but I've.
Speaker A:I lived in the South.
Speaker A:They.
Speaker A:They love their Civil War reenactments, but.
Speaker B:It'S an excuse to drink and act like you went to war.
Speaker A:Yeah, I also.
Speaker A:So when I was in Kentucky, we had a.
Speaker A:One of my professors was.
Speaker A:He did Civil War reenactments, and then he was like, a Civil War Bob is the one that made us watch this movie.
Speaker A:And then he picked two of us to.
Speaker A:He had a Union uniform and a full legit Confederate uniform.
Speaker A:And so I got picked with a buddy of mine to go.
Speaker A:We went to his house, and we got to try on the uniform.
Speaker A:And then, like, we dressed up in this uniform, and he actually had old Civil War muskets that he taught us how to load and then fire.
Speaker A:So we went out, and this was.
Speaker A:Shows the sign of the times because you'd never be able to do this nowadays.
Speaker A:But, like, we went out in this big field out by our high school that was out back of it, and it was.
Speaker A:And we were in this full wool, by the way, this was legit.
Speaker A:And it was hot as fuck.
Speaker A:And it was like springtime in Kentucky.
Speaker B:Was it JJ Hot or was it.
Speaker A:No, dude.
Speaker A:Like, this was, like, horrid hot.
Speaker C:Like, seriously, this is probably why you hate the heat.
Speaker A:It could be like, it was full, like, okay, so you have like your normal, like I had normal under clothes on, right?
Speaker A:And then you had this, this button up shirt that went on and then there was this, the blue jacket.
Speaker A:And because I moved from Kentucky from, to Kentucky from Ohio, he made me wear the Union uniform.
Speaker A:And then my buddy who was from Tennessee, he put in the, the Confederate one.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker A:But I put on this jacket and it's heavy as hell.
Speaker A:It weighs like seven pounds.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:And it's made of pure wool.
Speaker A:Like I'm not kidding, it's not like kind of wool.
Speaker A:It's like that nasty scratchy ass blanket that your grandpa used to keep in the back of the truck that he like.
Speaker A:Because if you got cold, you put it on and it's super heavy, but it itches like a.
Speaker A:Again, it didn't matter.
Speaker A:Like I had like that shirt on, but it itched right through it.
Speaker A:And then the pants were just wool too.
Speaker A:And then you had this big ass heavy leather belt.
Speaker A:So by the time you're done, it's like packing a 15 pound backpack on your body.
Speaker A:Then you have this musket that weighs like 12 pounds.
Speaker A:Like it was wild how much?
Speaker A:And I'm like, this is crazy.
Speaker A:And then to think about these guys running in this and then being out there in the heat and the humidity, I was like, I would have, I would have died.
Speaker A:I'd have been the, that got caught running away like in that first scene.
Speaker A:Like that have been my ass.
Speaker A:And I'd have been one of those three that are like, you can court martial my ass.
Speaker A:I ain't doing it because that was hot.
Speaker A:And so we went out, but we, he let us like do like in front of the like the whole class was sitting there.
Speaker A:And so then we would line up and we, we loaded the musket.
Speaker A:But without the ball, obviously.
Speaker A:But cool thing about musk is you can load them without the ball and still fire them.
Speaker A:And it's like you're firing them.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And we got to fire it.
Speaker A:Outside the high school, that was the wildest.
Speaker A:I was like this, you could never get away with that today.
Speaker A:But yeah, so it was crazy.
Speaker A:But that in that, that moment like really got me into like what else about the Civil War and then what about history in general, especially our country's history.
Speaker A:But it was nuts.
Speaker A:It was a lot of fun.
Speaker A:But God, I was glad to take that off.
Speaker A:It was so hot.
Speaker A:It was horrible.
Speaker A:So I can't even imagine these guys like in that uniform, running down a hill, climbing up the hill, for crying out loud.
Speaker A:And then like it's not a small hill.
Speaker C:It says, oh, Round Top, but it.
Speaker A:Is not a small hill.
Speaker A:Little, my ass.
Speaker A:Only because it's littler than big.
Speaker A:Round Top.
Speaker A:That's the only thing it's not little.
Speaker B:Okay, let's just call what it is you would have been in the artillery.
Speaker A:Oh, even that.
Speaker A:I don't know if I would have done.
Speaker B:Like, it have been hot as balls over there, too, dude.
Speaker A:I still had to wear that uniform.
Speaker A:I would have died.
Speaker A:I would have died.
Speaker A:Because then as you're sweating, it soaks it all up so it gets even heavier.
Speaker A:I'm out.
Speaker A:I would have literally died.
Speaker A:Not because I got shot or anything.
Speaker B:But, like, JJ would have been smoking and chewing that tobacco to an early death.
Speaker A:Yeah, I.
Speaker A:Sucking up.
Speaker A:I'll watch this whole movie.
Speaker A:I was like, I want a cigar, God damn it.
Speaker A:It's all that good Southern tobacco.
Speaker A:Becky to Becca.
Speaker A:I've had my good fair share of Southern tobacco.
Speaker A:Yeah, I.
Speaker A:I really like this movie, no matter how long it is.
Speaker A:And I, I.
Speaker A:One of my favorite, like, some of my favorite parts, to be honest, which is weird for me, is like, the.
Speaker A:The overdub.
Speaker A:Like, the.
Speaker A:The recording of their thoughts.
Speaker A:Like, the first one you see is.
Speaker B:Generally surprising that you.
Speaker B:That's very uncharacteristic.
Speaker A:The re.
Speaker A:There's a reason for it, and that's because those.
Speaker A:The lines that you hear that are audio over, and it's the thoughts of, like, Chamberlain and General Lee.
Speaker A:And I think there was one other one that they had do it, but those are directly out of their journals.
Speaker A:Like, they're not written for the movie.
Speaker A:Those came directly from those men's journals.
Speaker A:And, like, so the whole Chamberlain, where he's talking about everything that they're doing in the war and stuff like that, like, all of that came directly for.
Speaker A:They.
Speaker A:They didn't change it.
Speaker A:They didn't grammatically correct it.
Speaker A:Like, that was what they wrote in their journal, and they.
Speaker A:That's why they did it that way.
Speaker A:So sitting and listening to that and then being able to have, like.
Speaker A:Even though we know it's Martin Sheen's face, but to listen to, like, the words of General Roberts Lee in the midst of this, understanding that right now they're winning the war.
Speaker A:At this point, they're winning the war not by a large margin, but enough that they're confident and.
Speaker A:But to still have the reservations and the thoughts and how are we going to do this?
Speaker A:And is this the right call?
Speaker A:And to have to have the weight of that entire process on your Shoulders and then, oh my gosh.
Speaker A:But I love those moments because I'm like, I'm listening to the words of these people that actually lived in this moment.
Speaker A:And that's wild to me.
Speaker A:Like, that's why I think when you can read that or listen to that kind of thing, that's so cool to get that kind of insight into this person, that these people that historically are giants, right?
Speaker A:And man, just to know that they were thinking probably the same thing that most of us would have been thinking, at least to some extent.
Speaker A:Where there's, there's fear, there's trepidation, there's doubt, there's overconfidence, there's a lack of confidence.
Speaker A:All those things that are going through those guys minds.
Speaker A:It's so cool to me.
Speaker A:So I, I love that part of this movie that they actually found a way to inject that into the movie.
Speaker A:So I think that's my favorite part.
Speaker A:Okay, should we rate this thing?
Speaker B:Let's do it.
Speaker A:It's a very short podcast for a very long ass movie, but I like it.
Speaker A:All right, Alec, kick us off, buddy.
Speaker C:My movie, my go.
Speaker C:I'm gonna give it four and a half.
Speaker C:It's the little nitpicky things that pull me out of the movie and they're important.
Speaker C:Like, I know that's the way it is and everything like that, but it just at times is so hokey that it ruins almost the real kind of message behind the movie or the importance or the gravitas that was happening.
Speaker C:But it's, it's an enjoyable watch.
Speaker C:Like it's something that never feels as long as it actually is.
Speaker C:And I mean, it's also one where you don't really want to skip through the monologues or the quieter parts or the less parts because they, they're so important.
Speaker C:They still have a lot of draw to them to where, I mean, there's no easy way to cut it down.
Speaker C:And some other movies you'd be like, ah, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip, skip.
Speaker C:Here you can't really do that, but I'll give it a four and a half and I will sit down and watch this anytime.
Speaker A:I like it.
Speaker A:Madison.
Speaker B:I mean, I agree with Alec that you can't skip the dialogue, but this movie does feel long.
Speaker B:I don't, I don't know what universe that you live in.
Speaker B:It definitely is a long movie.
Speaker B:Like I.
Speaker B:You can't, you can't trick yourself with that.
Speaker B:I would say the same thing about a movie that I love, Being the Dark Knight.
Speaker B:It's a long movie.
Speaker B:And like I said with that movie, you've got to be invested into this movie.
Speaker B:It's not something that you can pop in, pop out.
Speaker B:Like you want to do it right, you got to sit down, you got to have the snacks, got to have the time.
Speaker B:Got to give it the respect that it deserves.
Speaker B:So with that, I'm going to give it a three and a half.
Speaker B:Obviously a massive docking for the amount of time.
Speaker B:But if you are into history and you haven't seen this movie and you like, like American history and the Civil War and things like, you should definitely see this movie.
Speaker B:You should go read Killer Angels.
Speaker B:I think you'll enjoy what's on screen, take some time, maybe split up into two chunks, a Saturday Sunday thing, but you'll be happy that you did.
Speaker A:Yeah, I'm going to give it a four and a half as well.
Speaker A:I'm with kind of in between the two of you.
Speaker A:Like I can feel that it's long when I think about it, but I get lost in this movie.
Speaker A:So like I was, when I watched it, I was sitting there going, I'm three hours in already.
Speaker A:I'm like, I've been watching this for a long ass time, but I like what I'm watching.
Speaker A:And, and while I can feel every moment of the four, especially like the last like half an hour of this extended edition, I was like, good lord, this is long.
Speaker A:But when I'm watching it, like I get really wrapped up in what's going on.
Speaker A:And the dialogue for me, like I.
Speaker A:And I said the, the overdub dialogue is really great and I love it for that very reason.
Speaker A:But the conversations too, like the conversation, conversations between, like the one where they're sitting at the top of the rock after the battle of Little Round Top and like the Chamberlain brothers are discussing everything together and like what's been going on.
Speaker A:Or the moment where like I said, Tom Behringer's talking to Stephen Lang and, and like you're like, geez.
Speaker A:Like, this is like the conversations feel really long, but if you sit down and you listen to them, they're having this meaningful dialogue about I don't want to do this.
Speaker A:This isn't the right choice, but I'm gonna do it because my general has told me to do it.
Speaker A:And so they weighing all these options out.
Speaker A:Anyway, like, I just love the dialogue in this movie.
Speaker A:Even more so than the battle.
Speaker A:If I'm skipping anything, it's the battle scenes.
Speaker A:Because I don't care so much about most of like those scenes.
Speaker A:Of, like, the fights.
Speaker A:Like, I understand what's happening there.
Speaker A:I want to listen to these men talk to each other, to themselves.
Speaker A:And that's what really gets me to this.
Speaker A:Because that understanding of where they're at and, like, what they're thinking and how they're planning, that stuff really intrigues the out of me.
Speaker A:So I do get lost in it.
Speaker A:So I forget that I'm watching four and a half hours or almost five hours of movie.
Speaker A:So, yeah, I highly recommend go watching this, too.
Speaker A:I will say my.
Speaker A:If I'm.
Speaker A:I'm docking it for.
Speaker A:For till four and a half.
Speaker A:It's a combination of the fact that it is almost five hours long and the goofy that Alex talking about that I can't help but giggle at as I'm watching it.
Speaker A:I'm like, I shouldn't be laughing during this movie, at this part, because people are dying.
Speaker A:But I can't help.
Speaker A:This guy jumps like three feet in the air because of a musket ball.
Speaker A:It's just like, I even understand, like.
Speaker A:And the other one that bothers me, that's really stupid that it bothers me as much as it does is the cannonball.
Speaker A:Like, that's not how cannonballs back then worked.
Speaker A:Like, they had some that were explosive, but most of the time those were on naval ships and they had artillery.
Speaker A:But these were cannons.
Speaker A:These weren't like boom, boom stuff.
Speaker A:This is like, hit somebody and tear you in half.
Speaker A:You know what I mean?
Speaker A:Like, that's.
Speaker A:These are cannonballs.
Speaker A:They'd hit and roll for 3ft and break people's legs and tear them off.
Speaker A:And I get.
Speaker A: You can't show that in: Speaker A:But at the same time, like, every time a cannonball exploded, like, they didn't explode.
Speaker A:God damn it.
Speaker B:But what I feel like they showed they could have.
Speaker B:They had movies that showed that they just decided that wasn't this movie.
Speaker B:PG 13.
Speaker A:Oh, that.
Speaker A:I don't know.
Speaker A:Could be.
Speaker A:I.
Speaker A:There were a couple of scenes where they showed, like, dudes missing legs and stuff.
Speaker A:So.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:And like.
Speaker A:So I don't know.
Speaker A:What is it?
Speaker A:Oh, Israelite.
Speaker A:Pg.
Speaker A:Good Lord.
Speaker B:Well, there you go.
Speaker B:There's your answer.
Speaker A:That's fair.
Speaker A:But I don't know why that bothers me so much, but exploded.
Speaker A:And that's not just this movie.
Speaker A:Anytime they show war movies with exploding cannonballs, it pisses me off.
Speaker A:Like contact with the earth, like earth flying up in the air, that's fine.
Speaker A:But the explosions and the fire coming out.
Speaker B:Explosions.
Speaker A:I hate that.
Speaker A:Explosions, explosions.
Speaker A:I love Explosions, just not from a cannonball.
Speaker A:Like not from a 12 pound piece of freaking lead.
Speaker A:Like that's not how that worked.
Speaker A:But anyway, I digress.
Speaker B:I actually appreciate that they made this movie PG though because.
Speaker B:Yeah, it just allows kids that do get enthralled with something like this to not have to like parents don't have to have the war of like.
Speaker B:Well, like, you know, they read the book, they should watch it.
Speaker B:I don't know, like, don't get me wrong, I love a good war scene.
Speaker B:I love seeing the realism.
Speaker B:But like, you know, it's also kind of nice.
Speaker B:You want to watch it with like your 8 year old son, like go for it.
Speaker A:Yeah, well, it's realistic enough that you understand that you're watching a war movie.
Speaker A:Right?
Speaker A:But I'm with you.
Speaker A:Like I don't need to see a cannonball roll down and tear some dude's leg off for me to go.
Speaker A:And I understand they need it to be dramatic so that you know that a cannonball landed.
Speaker A:But it bothers me.
Speaker A:I don't.
Speaker A:It's stupid.
Speaker A:It's a me thing.
Speaker A:But anyway, that's my four and a half.
Speaker A:I will watch this almost anytime, but I break it up typically.
Speaker A:Like I will usually watch it in two parts.
Speaker A:I didn't this time.
Speaker A:But there used to be when it came out on VHS.
Speaker A:That's how old this movie was.
Speaker A:Back in the 90s there were two VHS tapes and I don't remember where the cutoff was.
Speaker A:I think it might have been the battle of Little Round Top.
Speaker A:Once that was done, they had that conversation between the Chamberlain brothers and then it cut and it's like, please insert tape too.
Speaker A:So that's how old I am is.
Speaker A:I watched that when you had to break it apart and watch it in two movies.
Speaker A:So I still do.
Speaker B:I don't think I've had to deal with the VHS, but definitely did that with a few DVDs for sure.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:Lord of the Rings being the easiest example of that.
Speaker A:Yep.
Speaker A:This was the first time I ever watched a movie that I had to swap VHS tapes.
Speaker A:And I sure did.
Speaker A:It was fun.
Speaker A:So there it is.
Speaker A:Our we kick off.
Speaker A:What a way to kick off of May and the month of war movies.
Speaker A:And I like it.
Speaker A:I like our picks.
Speaker A:I like that we started with this one.
Speaker A:It's an interesting movie and I love it.
Speaker A:So we'll see you for the rest of them.
Speaker A:But Alec, before we go, tell everybody where they can find us.
Speaker C:Happy to J.J.
Speaker C:like J.J.
Speaker C:just said, this is week one of our wartime movies.
Speaker C:And best part is there was no other kind of parameters other than war movies.
Speaker C:So we're gonna be going all over the place in history.
Speaker C:It's gonna be a fantastic month.
Speaker C:Shout out to our patrons.
Speaker C:It's Charles and Rich who made the selection for this and then made the selection for war movies, then went ahead and made the selection of which movies to choose from.
Speaker C:So there that lineup is entirely on them.
Speaker C:They picked a great one.
Speaker C:Don't come at me in the comments.
Speaker C:It wasn't my fault.
Speaker C:Speaking of the Patreon, that's the place to get involved in our content.
Speaker C:We have a ton of extra episodes out, ton of behind the scenes content.
Speaker C:You can get involved in the voting process to select topics and to select movies that go inside the topics.
Speaker C:So follow us there.
Speaker C:What's our verdict?
Speaker C:Reviews to get all of your whatsoever needs taken care of.
Speaker C:With that, I'll kick it back to the Maharajah of Mash, the King of Crash.
Speaker A:Oh, jj, love it.
Speaker A:Thanks, Alec.
Speaker A:Yeah, go check out Patreon.
Speaker A:It's fun.
Speaker A:Yeah, we really are kind of all over the place this month.
Speaker A:Are they pattern?
Speaker A:Yeah, there's no like connective tissue other than war.
Speaker A:All sorts of crazy stories too, but they're all kind of heart wrenching and interesting in their own ways.
Speaker A:But yeah, with that as always, we appreciate you tuning in.
Speaker A:We'll catch you on the next one.
Speaker C:Hasta la vista, baby.
Speaker A:Cinematic out.
