Ghostbusters (1984) vs. Men in Black (1997)
JJ, Mattson and Alec delve into a comparative analysis of two iconic films: "Ghostbusters" and "Men in Black." The salient point of discussion centers on the thematic and stylistic similarities and differences between these two cinematic endeavors, both of which depict teams confronting supernatural entities—ghosts in the former and extraterrestrials in the latter. As we engage in an in-depth exploration, we examine the narrative structures, character dynamics, and the overarching humor that permeates both films, ultimately illuminating how each film has carved its unique niche within popular culture. Throughout the discourse, we reflect on the enduring legacies of these films and their impact on subsequent generations, highlighting how they continue to resonate with audiences today. Our reflections culminate in a spirited debate regarding the merits of each film, ultimately revealing the profound influence they wield within the realm of comedy and science fiction cinema.
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Transcript
They better not release this for real.
Speaker A:For real.
Speaker A:Because then, like Tommy Lee Jones and Will Smith are gonna disappear one day.
Speaker A:They're out in the secrets you watch.
Speaker A:These are just gonna be gone one day because the real men in black are gonna come take them away.
Speaker A:Welcome to the what's a Verdict podcast.
Speaker A:We fashion ourselves cinematic judging.
Speaker A:Jerry.
Speaker A:My name is JJ Crider.
Speaker A:I'm here with my co hosts Matt and Heiner.
Speaker B:Better red than dead.
Speaker A:And Alec Burgess.
Speaker C:Let's get it.
Speaker A:We appreciate you tuning in.
Speaker A:Go and hit that follow subscribe bell notification buttons.
Speaker A:Hit them all.
Speaker A:Helps keep up with the podcast and our new episodes also help us grow the podcast.
Speaker A:Tell a friend, tell a family member, tell one of either an alien hunter or a ghost hunter about us.
Speaker C:We don't tell ghost hunters about me.
Speaker A:Yeah, that's right.
Speaker C:Leave ghost hunters out.
Speaker A:You'll ruin Alex day if you tell the ghost hunters.
Speaker A:But tell them anyway because we like that.
Speaker A:But yeah.
Speaker A:So we're here and we're in week two of our arbitration month.
Speaker A:Back getting back to the roots.
Speaker A:And this time we've got this one up and coming.
Speaker A:Oh, where's the audio?
Speaker B:Oh.
Speaker A:Now I'm mad.
Speaker A:Where's the audio?
Speaker A:I don't know what happened.
Speaker A:Anyway, you saw it.
Speaker A:Anyway, if those listening, we had a nice little versus there.
Speaker A:And so it's Ghostbusters versus Men in Black.
Speaker A:Not quite twin movies, but we got some similarities there.
Speaker A:So let's dive into them first.
Speaker A: ,: Speaker A:It was written by Dan Aykroyd and Harold Ramis, a little bit from Rick Moranis.
Speaker A:It was directed by Ivan Reitman, stars Bill Murray, Dan Aykroyd, Sigourney Weaver, Harold Ramos, Rick Moranis, Andy Potts, William Atherton, Ernie Hudson and David Margulis.
Speaker A:It's about three parapsychologists forced out of their university funding.
Speaker A:Setup shop as a unique ghost removal service in New York City, attracting frightened yet skeptical customers.
Speaker A:And that is verse.
Speaker A: ,: Speaker A:It was written by L.
Speaker A:Cunningham and Ed Solomon.
Speaker A:It's directed by Barry Sonnenfeld.
Speaker A:Stars Tommy Lee Jones, Will Smith, Linda for Fiorentino, Vincent Dafio, Rip Torn, Tony Shalub Shaban Fallen Hgit Fallon Hogan, Jesus, Her Name is Rough, Mike Nussbaum and John Grease.
Speaker A:It was about James and then New York City cop is hired by Agent K of a secret government agency that monitors extraterrestrial life on earth.
Speaker A:Together, they must recover an item that has been stolen by an intergalactic villain.
Speaker A:Alec, I Need you to expound for me.
Speaker A:Like, what made you put these two together?
Speaker C:Excellent question.
Speaker C:I didn't.
Speaker B:Fair enough.
Speaker C:I've been salty this whole month.
Speaker C:I'm gonna continue to be salty because neither one of my picks made it in.
Speaker A:Oh, so this wasn't your pick?
Speaker C:This wasn't my pick.
Speaker A:I could have sworn this.
Speaker C:This has got Matson written all over it.
Speaker A:That's also fair that.
Speaker A:Touche.
Speaker A:Touche.
Speaker A:So then I'll redirect the question now.
Speaker A:That little baby race here, what Matt said, what made you put these two together?
Speaker B:Did I pick these?
Speaker B:I must have, right?
Speaker A:That's what I'm being told.
Speaker A:I can't keep track of that anymore.
Speaker A:Yeah, that's right, because Alex was Count and man in the Iron Mask and then Hook and Princess Bride, so.
Speaker B:Well, the way that I.
Speaker B:I looked at it.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker B:Was you've got two crews that are hunting one's for aliens, one's for ghosts.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:They're two very different entities, but they are comedic journeys to find a resolution to a significant problem at hand.
Speaker B:And, yeah, I thought while it was different, it was very much the same.
Speaker A:It's fair.
Speaker A:I mean, it's basically the same story.
Speaker B:I mean, you could have put aliens in.
Speaker B:You could have called it Alien Hunter.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:And it would have been the same movie, and you could have called it Ghosts in Black.
Speaker B:And.
Speaker A:Funny.
Speaker B:I just started.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker B:So, like, I.
Speaker B:I thought there's enough similarities there to do it.
Speaker B:And I think both movies are very.
Speaker B:I want to do something that was very iconic and well known by many people.
Speaker B:I think a lot of people that watch movies have seen Ghostbusters, and I still think a fair bit of people saw Men in Black.
Speaker B:As I remember, when I was growing up, like, Will Smith was kind of at the top of his game.
Speaker B:This movie came out, and I remember a lot of people went and saw this movie, and it made enough money on the first one because they made some horrible sequels.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:So I wanted to throw it out there, put my hat in the ring.
Speaker B:I forgot I.
Speaker B:I submitted this, but I'm proud that I did.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Oh, it worked out.
Speaker A:It was fun watching these again.
Speaker A:So I have a funny story about the first time I ever watched the Men in Black movie.
Speaker A:I've watched it highly illegally.
Speaker A:And so.
Speaker A:And this was before.
Speaker A:Pretty sure it was before we had, like, even the.
Speaker A:The, like, pirating videos, because this was, like.
Speaker A:So it was 96.
Speaker A:So this movie came out in 97.
Speaker A:And then I think it was 96.
Speaker A:We.
Speaker A:I was in Living in Kentucky at the time.
Speaker A:Was it Kentucky?
Speaker A:Yeah, we were in Kentucky and I was part of a.
Speaker A:Is in the high school band in Kentucky and we got invited to go down to Florida to do.
Speaker A:To march through Universal Studios.
Speaker A:So they do this like parade thing every weekend or something.
Speaker A:Anyway, so we got to go down like we were.
Speaker A:We went to state championship band competitions and stuff like that that year.
Speaker A:And so we had this really big.
Speaker A:We were pretty big for a band.
Speaker A:I mean a high school band, whatever.
Speaker A:It's a bigger deal in the east coast.
Speaker A:It is in the west coast.
Speaker A:So anyway, so we go over there, we go down, we take charter buses down to Florida from Kentucky.
Speaker A:It was a long ass bus ride, but we go down there and then we went to the Bahamas.
Speaker A:So we marched in the parade.
Speaker A:Then they took us on a boat down to the Bahamas for a day.
Speaker A:We spent the night in the Bahamas one night and we came back.
Speaker A:While we were in the Bahamas, my buddy Lamar decided that he was gonna go out to the Bahamas main island in town, which we had been advised against as a pale complected human being.
Speaker A:But Lamar is far from pale complected.
Speaker A:So he decided that he would be safe because that's Lamar.
Speaker A:So he goes downtown and he f.
Speaker A:They find this shop, he and a couple guys and they buy this on a VHS before.
Speaker A:So this was 96.
Speaker A:This movie did not come out until July of 97.
Speaker A:So we had it very early.
Speaker A:So we get on the bus and Lamar's like, I got a movie for us to watch.
Speaker A:Pops it in and it's Men in Black.
Speaker A:And it is a.
Speaker A:The tester.
Speaker A:So if you know anything about pre screening stuff like that, they.
Speaker A:It's actually rare that they do.
Speaker A:So they send them out for like people that do the reviews and stuff early.
Speaker A:So we got to see.
Speaker A:Somehow they got a copy of this pre screen video.
Speaker A:And so it was the whole movie, the only time we were watching it and it was really great.
Speaker A:And then all of a sudden we get to the end and you have the big bug that busts out of Edgar.
Speaker A:He's crawling up like the state fair, you know, whatever.
Speaker A:And the.
Speaker A:So instead of the bug, you see this white cutout of the bug's form because the CGI wasn't done yet in the screener.
Speaker A:And so I got to see this movie like six months before it hit the theaters in a freaking charter bus driving from Florida back to Kentucky.
Speaker A:It was really weird.
Speaker A:But yeah, that's my story for seeing Men in Black.
Speaker A:And then.
Speaker A:And there was a Couple others that had some really crappy CGI to it.
Speaker A:Like, there were moments where, like, the.
Speaker A:The worms or whatever when you go in and then, like, they weren't sitting there correctly.
Speaker A:It was really weird when you watched it.
Speaker A:And we were watching it on, like, a screen that was like, this big again, because we were on a charter bus, so there was, like four TVs that were, like, spread out.
Speaker A:But, yeah, that's how I saw Men in Black the first time.
Speaker A:But it was interesting.
Speaker A:Then I never went and saw it in theaters until, like, just before it was about to leave.
Speaker A:I think I saw it in a.
Speaker B:Dollar theater before this movie came out in 96.
Speaker A:97 is one of the.
Speaker A:July of 97 is when I thought.
Speaker B:I saw this movie in theaters.
Speaker B:I saw.
Speaker B:When did Wild, Wild west come out?
Speaker A:Oh, that would have been after.
Speaker B:Probably after 99.
Speaker B:Yeah, maybe I didn't see this in theaters, but, man, I'm pretty sure I.
Speaker B:I had a cool friend, Tyler Houston.
Speaker B:His dad was pretty dope.
Speaker B:I had a.
Speaker B:My own snack.
Speaker A:Not drawer.
Speaker B:My own snack cabinet at his house.
Speaker B:I literally went over there essentially every day.
Speaker B:And we had sleepovers.
Speaker B:Not every weekend, but at least three of four weekends every month.
Speaker B:And his dad just.
Speaker B:We saw movies that I.
Speaker B:I mean, they were fine, but I was like six or seven.
Speaker B:You know, like, maybe, maybe.
Speaker B:Maybe I should have been a little bit older, but maybe not.
Speaker B:They were fun.
Speaker B:I thought I saw this in theaters, but I'm not quite sure.
Speaker B:But I definitely.
Speaker B:Will Smith was a part of my childhood, we'll put it that way.
Speaker B:I mean, what I remember most from Men in Black especially is just.
Speaker B:There's just the.
Speaker B:The banter back and forth between Will Smith and I should be.
Speaker B:What's.
Speaker B:What's the other agent's name?
Speaker C:Tommy Lee Jones.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Yeah, Tommy Lee Jones.
Speaker B:Just the banter between the two of them I thought was really great.
Speaker B:And then the most probably iconic scene is when he gets his.
Speaker B:He gets his gun.
Speaker B:You think he's gonna get one of those big shiny guns and he gets the cricket and just the sheer disrespect that he.
Speaker B:The department gave him.
Speaker B:Like, I thought that was so funny as a kid because I was like.
Speaker B:They gave him a little like.
Speaker B:Like, like water gun or something, like, pew, pew, pew.
Speaker B:I thought that was great.
Speaker B:And then I think the other thing I remember the most from that movie is just the.
Speaker B:The shopkeeper that had, like, the head, the little head, the leg came out and like, the cgi, like.
Speaker B:I mean, the monsters were memorable.
Speaker B:I'LL say that, like the cockroach dude was.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Gross.
Speaker B:If nothing else, I think it pushed their boundaries a little bit of my imagination and that I appreciated.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:What about you, Alec?
Speaker A:Where did you see Men in Black first?
Speaker C:Let's see, I was three when it released, so I work with children.
Speaker C:I saw it like on TBS probably.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker C:Like, I don't know, a decade later.
Speaker C:That's fair because I think the first time I saw it.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:I mean, it's, it's hard to not like Will Smith when he was in the 90s, because that was like Matt was saying, peak Will Smith, top of the world, top of the game.
Speaker C:And it's, it's just he does such a good job in Men in Black, owning the scene there.
Speaker C:There's a very specific confidence that he's doing and like, even it shows up in it when he's in like the room with all the new recruits.
Speaker C:You know, he's moving the table.
Speaker A:To.
Speaker C:Take his test, you know, showing this problem solving skill or even just the, you know, sarcastic making fun of the guy.
Speaker C:Like, oh, yeah, he's so excited to be here.
Speaker C:He doesn't even know where he is or what he's doing.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker C:And so there's just the, the confidence.
Speaker C:And I think, like, was it something like.
Speaker C:This was one of the first big breakout roles for Will Smith, right?
Speaker A:Yeah, it was one of them.
Speaker A:Like, it was, it was a good follow up to like Independence.
Speaker B:Well, he had done Fresh Prince of Bel Air already.
Speaker B:Like, that's.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And he had done Independence Day.
Speaker A:I think at this point.
Speaker A:I don't remember exactly when Independence Day came out, but it was before this.
Speaker A:But yeah, he, I mean, he just.
Speaker C:Owns the screen and it came out in 96.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So right before.
Speaker C:It's not something you'd expect from someone who's kind of just kick starting their, you know, big movie screen career to come in and just kick off a franchise with less than stellar sequels.
Speaker C:But they're still good.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:I mean, it could be worse.
Speaker A:It can be worse.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:I, I think Men in Black was interesting.
Speaker A:We used to joke.
Speaker A:So again, Lamar, this guy was.
Speaker A:I love Lamar.
Speaker A:He was like one of my favorite people because he's so ridiculous and yet just so lovable.
Speaker A:Anyway, so like his thing was when this came out, like, I used to laugh because he, this.
Speaker A:They were, they would advertise this thing before we saw it.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:And we were in high school and he's like, man, they better not release this for real.
Speaker A:For real.
Speaker A:Because then like Tommy Lee Jones and Will Smith are gonna disappear one day.
Speaker A:They're out in the secrets.
Speaker A:You watch these is just gonna be gone one day because the real Men in Black are gonna come take them away.
Speaker A:Dude, to be honest with you, Alec, I would love to get you and Lamar in the same room because the two of you are like my conspiracy theory buddies.
Speaker A:Like, you and him could talk for hours, I think about the ridiculousness that you guys talk about.
Speaker A:It makes me giggle.
Speaker A:But yeah, like he would constantly.
Speaker A:He's like, I'm not watching that.
Speaker A:One day I'm gonna disappear.
Speaker A:Every who watch this movie is gonna get snatched up and go, or just.
Speaker B:Get your memory erased.
Speaker B:You don't even have to disappear.
Speaker B:You just effectively do it the same way, just more incognito.
Speaker A:Yeah, for real.
Speaker A:Well, and I think like that's what made me laugh the most about this movie at the time was you also had things like X Files that had been out and were out around this time earlier than this.
Speaker A:But the Men in Black thing was always like, they're this sinister thing to hide all the secrets.
Speaker A:And you know, and so when this came out and it was just so goofy, like that part was funny.
Speaker A:And I think one of the best scenes, to your point, Alec, is like when he's pulling that table across.
Speaker A:Like they're sitting in those silly egg chairs.
Speaker A:And then when they do like the shooting part of it and he's got to explain, like this dude's just, he's just sneezing.
Speaker A:Like this dude's working out, doing some pull ups.
Speaker A:Then like the quantum, she's got quantum physics books and what the hell is she doing walking around here with that?
Speaker A:Something right with that.
Speaker A:Am I wrong?
Speaker A:So, yeah, like I'm with you and only Will Smith at the time, I think could have pulled that off and made it fun.
Speaker A:And like you just kind of love that character maybe.
Speaker B:The only thing I feel like the only other person that could have done it maybe is the.
Speaker B:His partner in Bad Boys.
Speaker B:What was that guy, that actor's name?
Speaker B:I think Martin Lawrence could have done it.
Speaker B:I don't, I mean it wouldn't have been as Will Smith as Will Smith does it, but I think he could have been in the same type of vein.
Speaker B:They had similar play style.
Speaker B:I have a question for the rest of the group.
Speaker B:I have some, obviously how we're going to rate these against each other.
Speaker B:But before we do that, especially I want to ask Jay this question first.
Speaker B:Since we weren't even alive when said other movie came out.
Speaker B:Jay Talk to us about Ghostbusters.
Speaker B:I don't.
Speaker B:Do you.
Speaker B:Did you see it in theaters?
Speaker B:What do you remember?
Speaker B:Because to me, real fast, like, I don't remember exactly when I saw this movie.
Speaker B:I saw it because it's a classic.
Speaker B:Like, I feel like people should see this.
Speaker B:Does it hold the weight that I'm curious if it does for you because I like it.
Speaker B:I think it's a great movie.
Speaker B:It was interesting, but it wasn't like.
Speaker B:I imagine if I was a kid or an early teen and this movie came out, feel like this would have been revolutionary for me.
Speaker B:It was.
Speaker B:It was cool to see.
Speaker B:And I was like, wow.
Speaker B:Like, I can see why people care about.
Speaker B:Didn't have the same nostalgia for me.
Speaker B:But especially for you, since maybe you did see in theaters.
Speaker B:I'm curious.
Speaker A:So I didn't see in theaters.
Speaker A:This is one of those rare situations where I get to say that I was three years old when this movie.
Speaker B:Oh, really?
Speaker A:Wow.
Speaker B:JJ's not that old.
Speaker A:So you guys.
Speaker A:Yeah, I was three when this came out.
Speaker A:So no, I did not see it in theater, which is ironic because I, I what the very first movie I ever saw in theaters saw, I was two years old.
Speaker A:My dad took me to Return of The Jedi in 83, but I didn't see this one.
Speaker A:At least not that I know of.
Speaker A:Unless dad took me when I was three and didn't tell me, which he normally liked to tell me about.
Speaker A:Hi, bags.
Speaker A:What he's watching.
Speaker A:But, like, so I don't remember when I first saw this, like, how old I was or anything.
Speaker A:I would imagine that I had to have been like five or six.
Speaker A:But I remember two things vividly about this movie, and that is one.
Speaker A:I thought it was one of the greatest movies.
Speaker A:Like, it was so funny and it was entertaining and I laughed.
Speaker A:And then the other piece was, as I was young enough that it scared the out of me.
Speaker A:Like, I, you know, so did it.
Speaker B:Really did the Marshmallow Giant Marshmallow man got you.
Speaker A:No, it was the freaking weird lady in the library.
Speaker B:Oh, my gosh.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker A:You know what I mean?
Speaker A:And then, like, as funny as Slimer is, like, he's kind of creepy, as in this movie.
Speaker A:Like, and I.
Speaker A:It was funny because too, because this movie came out and then there was a cartoon that came out on Saturday morning cartoons that was about Ghostbusters.
Speaker A:And Slimer was like their sidekick.
Speaker A:This guy Slimer was like their sidekick.
Speaker A:So like everybody, he was cute.
Speaker A:And then you watch the movie and he's not cute in the movie when you're a little kid.
Speaker A:So yeah, so there was creepy when I was little.
Speaker A:It scared the out of me actually.
Speaker A:But no, it was a great movie and I love that stay puffed like stomping through New York City.
Speaker A:But.
Speaker A:And it was funny because when I saw you sent over your list or whatever and I'm looking at putting together the vote on Patreon.
Speaker A:There's my shameless plug.
Speaker A:Go get on Patreon.
Speaker A:You can vote for what we watch.
Speaker A:But we're.
Speaker A:When I was putting the list together on Patreon, the guy's like, oh, Ghostbusters and Men in Black.
Speaker A:Like I love Men in Black.
Speaker A:It's funny, but it's.
Speaker A:It's cursed.
Speaker A:There's no way that it can be in for me Ghostbusters.
Speaker A:Because that movie is like part of my childhood.
Speaker A:Hi bags.
Speaker A:In part of my life.
Speaker A:You know what I mean?
Speaker A:So it's.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:The nostalgia and all that is real for me with Ghostbusters because it's.
Speaker A:Yeah, but it was great.
Speaker B:Alec, what about you and Ghostbusters?
Speaker C:Ghostbusters.
Speaker C:Unlike the first 80s movies my dad tried to get me to watch and just like JJ it terrified me.
Speaker C:Unlike jj, I don't have fond memories of Slimer or related to my first watch on Ghostbusters.
Speaker C:Cuz that shit sucked.
Speaker C:Now going back, it's a little bit different because I watch movies in a very different light now.
Speaker C:And so going back to Ghostbusters, it's, you know, about the comedy and the team and the, you know, stuff that happens.
Speaker C:I guess outside of the actual ghost hunting that is.
Speaker C:That was on the second watch through anyway, what I focused mostly on.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker C:And then that's what's really stuck with me is the comedic factor.
Speaker C:And just, you know, Bill Murray with this sarcastic dry humor.
Speaker C:Oh, is.
Speaker C:Is pure gold.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:That's Bill Murray in the final showdown.
Speaker A:The amount of that Bill Murray talks to like like Zool.
Speaker A:Like.
Speaker A:And then like he gets when they get mad at Dan Aykroyd because he can't help but like think of the stay puff.
Speaker A:Like that moment in this movie is one of my favorite moments of all time.
Speaker A:It's just like where he's like, he's like what's yelling at him?
Speaker A:What is.
Speaker A:What was.
Speaker A:Why can't I think of his character's name?
Speaker A:I just keep wanting to say Dan Aykroyd, but Ray.
Speaker A:Ray.
Speaker A:They all look over at him.
Speaker A:What did you.
Speaker A:What did you do, Ray?
Speaker A:And then I'm also a huge Rick Moranis fan.
Speaker A:Like I grew up and I.
Speaker A:I guarantee neither of you have seen Strange Brew, but, like, that's where I.
Speaker A:You guys remember that?
Speaker B:Just to confirm for the listening audience, I haven't seen it.
Speaker A:Yeah, I'm sure, Alec, you haven't seen Strange Brew either.
Speaker A:Okay, well, you should watch it because Alec would laugh his ass off at this movie.
Speaker A:Matson, not so much.
Speaker C:I won't be watching, but I'll watch it.
Speaker A:Did you guys watch when you were kids?
Speaker A:Because this came out when you were kids, I think the animated movie with the two moose.
Speaker A:What is that called?
Speaker A:Brother Bear.
Speaker A:Brother Bear.
Speaker A:And they got the two Canadian moose.
Speaker A:Yeah, yeah, those.
Speaker C:Okay.
Speaker A:The guys that did the moose voices were Rick Moranis and some other guy.
Speaker A:I can't remember his name, but they're the lead guys in Strange Brew.
Speaker A:And so.
Speaker A:And they v that these characters are the moose, but they're human beings tracking down beer.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:And so it's like, dude, Alec, you gotta watch it, because I'm looking where.
Speaker C:I can stream it right now.
Speaker A:Yeah, it's hilarious.
Speaker A:But yeah, so that's.
Speaker A:Rick Moranis is always in it.
Speaker A:You know, honey, I shrunk the kids.
Speaker B:Like, he's always probably not very funny.
Speaker A:Just letting you know it's hilarious.
Speaker A:Just look it up, people.
Speaker A:So when they.
Speaker A:When he starts going too, he's like, I am the gatekeeper or the key master.
Speaker A:Like, Rick Moranis makes me laugh no matter what he does.
Speaker A:So this movie just has great comedic relief.
Speaker A:Two very different styles of comedy, I think.
Speaker A:But the two movies do compare very well comedically for sure.
Speaker B:All right, with that.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:Let's jump into our.
Speaker B:All right.
Speaker B:And say we're gonna do plot and storyline, character development, chemistry, special effects and visuals, humor and tone and cultural impact and legacy.
Speaker A:Oh, poor Banks.
Speaker A:What was the first one again?
Speaker B:We're gonna start with the plot and storyline.
Speaker B:Alec, we'll start with you.
Speaker C:Oh, with me?
Speaker C:I gotta go with Men in Black on the story and plot line.
Speaker C:I feel like the.
Speaker C:It's a more thought out.
Speaker C:There's a little bit more backstory involved with.
Speaker C:Brings you into the middle of a story.
Speaker C:But there's a before or a beginning, middle end.
Speaker C:Ghostbusters is kind of like, oh, hey, we bought a firehouse.
Speaker C:Because we figured out there's this.
Speaker C:This ghost hunting opportunity.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:The story is kind of what makes the movie.
Speaker C:But Men in Black is like you were saying with Lamar, it's almost like this could be real.
Speaker C:This could be something that works out, and we're just able to kind of come in and get a sneak peek of an actual thing that's happening.
Speaker C:And so I think the, the story from.
Speaker C:From anyway, it's like, yeah, Men in Black's a better.
Speaker C:I don't want to say better thought out story, but a better constructed story.
Speaker C:Whereas Ghostbusters, a typical old 80s movie.
Speaker A:Balls.
Speaker A:That's right.
Speaker B:I'll go.
Speaker B:This is more of a toss up for me, but I think I'm gonna go to Men in Black as well for Alec.
Speaker B:Still the point.
Speaker B:I was gonna say that to me, Men in Black has a more traditional story arc of like a beginning, middle and end where, like you sing about Ghostbusters, it just feels like something kind of dropped in their lap and it was, it was brought together.
Speaker B:But like, I, to me personally, I feel like I'm splitting hairs here, like to.
Speaker B:To say one or the other.
Speaker B:I think it's really close, but I would deviate towards Men in Black a little bit.
Speaker B:Yeah, just.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:It's a tough one for me.
Speaker B:When we did this in our.
Speaker B:Our last episode, it was so much more clear cut and dry.
Speaker B:I think it's going to be a lot tougher for me across the board on this.
Speaker A:Yeah, I don't.
Speaker A:This was tough.
Speaker A:Okay, so I'm gonna go Ghostbusters.
Speaker A:And I say that because of this.
Speaker A:And that is, to me, Men in Black, what it.
Speaker A:Where its success comes from are the characters that are in it and the enjoyment and the, the charisma that they exude.
Speaker A:Whereas the story itself, man, like, I just.
Speaker A:I'm like, okay, you could have plugged those two guys, Will Smith and Tommy Lee Jones.
Speaker A:And then, you know, your guest appearances from like a Tony Shalhoub or, you know, you.
Speaker A:The.
Speaker A:But those two characters, you could have dropped them into any story.
Speaker A:And I think it would have made that story better or successful, depending on how you're looking at it.
Speaker A:Ghostbusters, I think, is similar because again, it's just like this world ending, you know, theme that we're talking about that both stories have.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:And so this crew of goofy scientists that decide to be ghost hunters make the movie.
Speaker A: n Black, by the time I got to: Speaker A:I was watching this movie, I'd seen this storyline a million times.
Speaker A:Whereas when I was a kid and Ghostbusters came out like that existential dread of like being in New York City at the time where all these ghosts are running around in the city, like, that was new for me.
Speaker A:And so to me, it's.
Speaker A:It's obviously a timing issue because they're basically the same story just with ghosts and aliens.
Speaker A:But I think for me, because Ghostbusters is what I grew up on, that's where I give it to it.
Speaker A:But I think again, you have four guys that steal the scenes with some really fun.
Speaker A:And then you got Sigourney Weaver and you got.
Speaker A:So there's a lot of.
Speaker A:A lot more that makes the storyline more interesting and fills it out, rounds it out where Men in Black relies just on two guys who do it very well and successfully.
Speaker A:But that's.
Speaker B:I just feel like the ridiculousness of Men in Black at times is a little bit more that gets me into the kicks and giggles than at times that Ghostbusters does.
Speaker B:But we'll talk about that here shortly.
Speaker A:Sure.
Speaker B:Let's bounce over to character development and chemistry.
Speaker B:And I think JJ kind of just rolled into what really makes us rating hard to go first.
Speaker B:Like in Ghostbusters, you're talking about three, if not four, sometimes five people in a given scene that really are just interwoven quite well.
Speaker B:Or Men in Black is dominated by two individuals, but they also are killing it at almost any given time.
Speaker B:But I think that's.
Speaker B:I love Will Smith and Tommy Lee Jones and just how they go back and forth at each other, each other from like just the.
Speaker B:The.
Speaker B:The cricket scene to him getting in the car and Will Smith is not able to drive to like just shaming him left and right for being a rookie agent.
Speaker B:But then like Ghostbusters, you've just got.
Speaker B:To me, this is a quintessential Bill Murray and.
Speaker B:And Dan Arknoid movie where they're just.
Speaker B:I think I'm give it to Ghostbusters because it's more impressive to me to do it with more people for a longer period of time.
Speaker B:But again, splitting hairs for me it's.
Speaker B:It's.
Speaker B:It's tough.
Speaker B:It's close.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:I'm actually surprising to give this one the Men in Black.
Speaker A:And I think what flips it over, I think when we're talking about like the.
Speaker A:The ensemble cast or the cast itself and like their chemistry, I could go either way.
Speaker A:And I would tend.
Speaker A:If it was just about chemistry with the topic you're talking.
Speaker A:I would probably lean more towards Ghostbusters because.
Speaker A:Your point, the chemistry between a larger group is a little more difficult in theory.
Speaker A:But what steals it away is the character development.
Speaker A:There's not a lot of character development.
Speaker A:That's fair.
Speaker B:I lean relements a lot of the chemistry.
Speaker B:You're right.
Speaker B:You're right.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:And from a chemistry point of view, I would give it to Ghostbusters, but when you add in the dynamic of a character development on top of it, you have.
Speaker A:I have to give it to Men in Black because for nothing else than Jay actually has some character development.
Speaker A:Whereas in Ghostbusters, there's not real character development for the most part.
Speaker A:There's a little bit.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Like.
Speaker A:Because even Bill Murray, like, Bankman grows up a little bit.
Speaker A:And, like, you know, you have to add in the dynamic of.
Speaker A:Of bringing in the character anyway.
Speaker A:So, yes, there is some.
Speaker A:But I think the overarching theme of Jay growing and, you know, learning to work better as a team with K and then K letting.
Speaker A:Being a little more patient with Jay by the end and then them coming together, there's just more character development.
Speaker A:But again, it's just so close because both ensemble casts are so good.
Speaker A:But I think when comparatively to, like, giving it to a character, Will Smith's always gonna trump out some of these guys because especially at point.
Speaker A:God, he just oozes charisma.
Speaker A:Like, even after having a hard time with him after the whole slap situation, like, he's still hard to dislike when he's doing his thing.
Speaker A:And.
Speaker A:And so it's.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:But, yeah, I'm gonna give this one a Men in Black.
Speaker A:Barely.
Speaker C:I'm also going to give it to Men in Black.
Speaker C:I agree with what you were saying, jj, about there is no character development.
Speaker C:Ghostbusters.
Speaker C:If anything, there's, like, a regress.
Speaker C:But then for the chemistry, like, I think Ghostbusters gets in its own way a little bit where we just lost jj.
Speaker C:Cool.
Speaker C:You're muted too, Matt.
Speaker B:So I was just saying we lost our commander in chief.
Speaker C:That's perfect.
Speaker C:Don't let him back in.
Speaker B:And we.
Speaker B:We might not.
Speaker B:Oh, he's back.
Speaker B:Switching tiles up on us.
Speaker B:Jay.
Speaker A:I don't know what happened.
Speaker C:This is great.
Speaker C:I love it.
Speaker A:Men in Black.
Speaker A:They're coming for me now.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:Yeah.
Speaker C:So, like, the.
Speaker C:The chemistry goes better.
Speaker C:I think it gets in its own.
Speaker B:Way a little bit.
Speaker C:And what I think about that is poor Ernie Hudson.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker C:Is kind of like the odd man out.
Speaker C:And the chemistry that's there is really, you know, Dan Aykroyd and Bill Murray, and then you throw in Sigourney Weaver and Rick Moranis, who are both just going to mesh with whoever they are going to mesh with.
Speaker C:Like, it doesn't matter who you put those two with.
Speaker C:They'll find a way to find Chemistry.
Speaker C:And so I feel like it gets.
Speaker C:There's almost too much going on with the chemistry.
Speaker C:And so you have little isolated pockets of chemistry versus with Men in Black, it's just two.
Speaker A:Right?
Speaker C:There's only two people who are really.
Speaker C:Who really should be credited and are making the movie.
Speaker C:And so it.
Speaker C:It feels a little bit better, I guess, is the way to put it.
Speaker C:All right, let me give it Men in Black.
Speaker A:I will say that I have to.
Speaker A:One last caveat with Men in Black.
Speaker A:Is that the.
Speaker A:The.
Speaker A:The girl, Linda Laurel or Linda Fiorentino from.
Speaker A:That's the.
Speaker A:The chick.
Speaker A:Like, I don't like her.
Speaker A:And so she's a hard one for me in Men in Black.
Speaker A:Like, I don't like the character.
Speaker A:I don't like.
Speaker A:Like, so she's a downside.
Speaker A:But I still give it to Men in Black for all the reasons I said.
Speaker A:But anyway, I have to put that caveat in there.
Speaker B:All right, Alec, kick us off for special effects and visuals.
Speaker C:My least favorite thing about movies because I really don't care about the special effects or the visuals.
Speaker B:Kind of important in both of these movies, though.
Speaker C:I.
Speaker C:I know it's kind of important, but that's not something that I really pay attention to.
Speaker B:Like the vision and why we don't listen to Alec so, you know, because he likes movies.
Speaker B:When you like movies in black and white, like, are you really caring about anything?
Speaker C:Hold the up.
Speaker C:I like practical effects movies because practical effects is better.
Speaker C:I'll just say, especially during the 80s and 90s and there's some practical effects.
Speaker B:In Ghostbusters, I am aware of the practical effects.
Speaker B:Letting our listening audience know.
Speaker B:You just gotta.
Speaker B:Gotta listen out with a grain of salt right here.
Speaker B:Just.
Speaker A:Just.
Speaker B:Yeah.
Speaker C:I mean, I'm going to give it to Ghostbusters.
Speaker C:I think Ghostbusters does a better job with the special effects and the visuals.
Speaker C:Giant Marshmallow Man Zool is still terrifying to me, and I'm 31 years old, so I.
Speaker C:I'm gonna give it to Ghostbusters.
Speaker A:That's funny.
Speaker A:What about you, Matson.
Speaker B:Banks has got a little toy next to me.
Speaker B:I gotta turn that down, dude.
Speaker B:I don't know if they can hear that.
Speaker B:What?
Speaker B:I mean, I think when you watch Ghostbusters, like, was it groundbreaking, some of the things that they were doing at the time?
Speaker B:I'm sure it was, but it sure doesn't look as good these days.
Speaker B:And Men in Black, they blended.
Speaker B:There's definitely CGI moments and some practical moments.
Speaker B:I remember Men in Black more.
Speaker B:It's probably just because it's a nostalgia thing.
Speaker B:When I was a kid and I saw Ghostbusters when I was older, I could be like, oh, like I knew what they were trying to do there, but doesn't look that good.
Speaker B:But then again, the giant marshmallow man, like, that was pretty great.
Speaker B:Like, I won't ever be forgetting that.
Speaker B:I think I just like aliens more.
Speaker B:And so I thought it was cooler, more intricate, and I still thought it looked pretty good to.
Speaker B:To this day and age.
Speaker B:And maybe I'm a little bit biased, but I think I just appreciate a little bit more of the.
Speaker B:How their special effects helped with the world building in ways that I think we had here and there glimpses of that in Ghostbusters.
Speaker B:But in Men in Black we had a lot more of that and I appreciated it.
Speaker C:I'm so glad you mentioned the Stay Puft guy, because that was a practical effect.
Speaker B:It was pretty great.
Speaker B:But like the.
Speaker B:When the temple opened or whatever at the end with the, the like the not lion like weird alien ghost thing, like doesn't look that good these days, but I'm sure it looked good back then.
Speaker A:Yeah, I think it's a.
Speaker A:This one's a tough for me.
Speaker A:Tough one for me because I.
Speaker A:I think of two scenes in particular.
Speaker A:One we've already talked about Stay Pu.
Speaker A:Walking down the streets in New York and knowing how they did that and the fact that they did that was dope.
Speaker A:The other scene from Men in Black though, is when they.
Speaker A:He first walks into like the wide open spot of MIB headquarters Aliens.
Speaker A:And there's.
Speaker A:And it's all cgi and it still looks pretty good even considering it's cgi.
Speaker A:So I, I think of those two scenes, but I'm also biased and I look, my biases is showing because I have a huge taste for practical effects.
Speaker A:And to Matt's point, some of them don't hold up as well in, in Ghostbusters, but I still appreciate that.
Speaker A:And so I look at this from the lens of.
Speaker A:I find CGI kind of in.
Speaker A:This is terrible because it's a lot of work, but it's.
Speaker A:I feel it's.
Speaker A:I feel it.
Speaker A:Find it lazy because you can make anything look like anything with a computer and it's how well you do it.
Speaker A:Now Men in Black does it very well comparatively.
Speaker A:There's some that I'm like, Gez, this is terrible.
Speaker A:That were even come after Men in Black.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Like later on movies where it should have been better were as good.
Speaker A:But when it comes to like being able to figure out how to have stay puffed or even things like slimer or the crazy ghost lady that's flying around.
Speaker A:You know what I mean?
Speaker A:Like all of those, like how I look at it and I go, how the did they do that versus when I look at Men in Black, I go, I know exactly how they did that.
Speaker A:They have a computer program that did it.
Speaker A:So for me, that's why Ghostbusters will win.
Speaker A:For me, it's not that I think that the effects are that much better.
Speaker A:I just think that they're different.
Speaker A:And I like practicality versus cgi.
Speaker A:So it's a completely biased decision, but I'll own that biases and run with it.
Speaker A:So I give that to Ghostbusters.
Speaker A:But again, it's real close.
Speaker A:Like there's nothing here that I'm like one or the other is a runaway favorite.
Speaker A:Right?
Speaker A:Like, I think it's just they're all very close.
Speaker A:But that's just my personal thing.
Speaker A:Like I think when I think of the two main scenes, it's those two.
Speaker A:And Stay Puft wins.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:What was the next category?
Speaker B:Well, I have one follow up question.
Speaker B:So what about like a movie like Ready Player One with those special effects like CGI and they're like extremely intricate and.
Speaker B:Well, like the scene I'm thinking of is when he's in the race and he throws out his little thing in the car, like builds.
Speaker B:Obviously we'd love for that to be a practical effect, but that would take years.
Speaker B:And I think that was a really meticulous CGI that took a long time and was very complex and a lot of work.
Speaker B:And I'm curious if you have a different opinion on something like that being lazy versus like practical effects.
Speaker A:It's probably, like I said, it's probably.
Speaker B:I should preface this.
Speaker B:One of my favorite movies of all time is.
Speaker B:Is what's the dinosaur?
Speaker B:Why am I forgetting?
Speaker B:Yeah, Jurassic Park.
Speaker B:It's incredible movie because the practical effects are unmatched.
Speaker B:And so I'm not saying I think I have the same sentiment as you, but then like a movie like Ready Player One that I'm actually like, I can see the amount of work and the time and I think it did pay off.
Speaker B:But I'm curious your opinion.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:So I think it's tough too because you got to think about what movies can you pull off with without CGI and with CGI and Ready Player One because of its nature and what the story is actually about.
Speaker A:Like it's about a virtual world.
Speaker A:So if you weren't using Virtual effects.
Speaker A:I'd be a little concerned because, like, that's the idea behind that one.
Speaker A:So I think two things about your question.
Speaker A:One, yes, Ready Player one does it very well when it comes to cgi.
Speaker A:You can tell that there was a.
Speaker A:And I think that comes down to a Steven Spielberg thing where he's like, look, one Steven Spielberg is not going to let you get away with.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:He's been involved in too many.
Speaker A:I mean, he was very heavily involved in helping Lucas make Star wars early on.
Speaker A:He did the, you know, the Indiana Jones movies, which had practical effects.
Speaker A:So, like, the guy knows how to do effects that are impressive, so, you know, he's going to make him put in the work for that.
Speaker A:And two, I think it leans heavily into the world that it was built in.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker B:We're.
Speaker A:We need it to be CGI because they're in a virtual reality world.
Speaker A:And so if it looked practical, it might be a little weird.
Speaker A:I will say that I.
Speaker A:What impressed me the most, if we're talking about Ready Player one real quick, the fact that they make the world building of the stacks in Columbus and stuff like that feel very practical.
Speaker A:Even though the stacks were very much cgi, that, to me was the most successful part of that virtual.
Speaker A:Those CGI was the, the real world felt real, even though most of it, especially in the stacks area, was very much cgi.
Speaker A:So, yeah, I, I, yeah, that's it.
Speaker A:That one's kind of a standalone.
Speaker A:There's a couple movies that their effects are.
Speaker A:It's kind of like the thing on the other side of it, right.
Speaker A:Like when we, when we watched and did the thing.
Speaker A:There's very few movies that, from a practical effect standpoint, can compare to the thing Ready Player one's the same way when it comes to cgi.
Speaker A:Like, it's hard.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker B:All right.
Speaker B:All right, Good to know.
Speaker B:Jumping to our next topic.
Speaker B:We will start with JJ on this one.
Speaker B:Humor and tone.
Speaker B:Very tough.
Speaker A:Wow.
Speaker A:This one's tough.
Speaker A:I'm gonna start with humor, and then I'm going to separate these two things.
Speaker A:So from a humorous perspective.
Speaker A:Humor perspective.
Speaker A:I think Men in Black wins barely.
Speaker A:And I think it's because Tommy Lee Jones and Will Smith are very successful at their comedy.
Speaker A:Like, they make me laugh.
Speaker A:The dynamic of outrageous.
Speaker A:Will Smith doing what he does and is always, like, on the go and moving quick and loud and obnoxious.
Speaker A:And then you've got Tommy Lee Jones who just, he only says what's necessary and when he's being funny.
Speaker A:God damn, he's funny.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:Like.
Speaker A:And so I love that about.
Speaker A:And it's.
Speaker A:It always works.
Speaker A:There's not a moment where I'm like, that didn't work.
Speaker A:What Ghostbusters suffers from is even though the.
Speaker A:The ensemble is great to Alex Point and Matson, you said it too.
Speaker A:It's about Dan Aykroyd and Bill Murray.
Speaker A:Those two are your Will Smith and your Tommy Lee Jones of this movie.
Speaker A:What happens then is you have these other characters that, when they are funny, are really funny, but they don't always hit the way that Bill Murray and.
Speaker A:And Dan Aykroyd hit.
Speaker A:Every single time.
Speaker A:Those two hit no matter what.
Speaker A:And it's funny.
Speaker A:You do have some moments with the.
Speaker A:There's characters in there that are trying to be funny, and they're not.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:And so that was why I give it to Men in Black for the humor.
Speaker A:Now the tone, I don't.
Speaker A:I don't think I could pick a winner from tone because they're so different.
Speaker A:Like, Men in Black is supposed to be ridiculous.
Speaker A:Then Ghostbusters is kind of back and forth.
Speaker A:Like, there's some ridiculous moments, but there's some pretty dark that happens in Ghostbusters.
Speaker A:And so I think from a tone, I'm gonna give it to Ghostbusters, even though it's really close.
Speaker A:And so because to me, like, I know exactly what I'm getting with Men in Black.
Speaker A:And it's a ridiculous comedy that's out there.
Speaker A:And there's.
Speaker A:There's some themes there, but it's not like they just lean into the funny.
Speaker A:Right.
Speaker A:And it's in the action.
Speaker A:Whereas Ghostbusters, there's some pretty heavy.
Speaker A:Like, you got everything from political weird, like people trying to save face to scary ghosts.
Speaker A:And then the dynamics of a team and how you can make that work.
Speaker A:They're throwing together this.
Speaker A:So there's some different things there.
Speaker A:I think overall, because comedy is the theme technically for both.
Speaker A:Men in Black wins the overall battle in this topic for me, but it's a tough one.
Speaker A:That's a tough one.
Speaker B:I think I can go next.
Speaker B:I think overall, I'll give it to Men of Black, but appreciate the way how JJ kind of separated it.
Speaker B:And we talked about, like, storyline and plot.
Speaker B:I still think the connection of Tommy Lee Jones and.
Speaker B:And Will Smith.
Speaker B:So J and K.
Speaker B:I just like their banter and dynamics a little bit more.
Speaker B:I think, like JJ talked about, they always hit.
Speaker B:And there's never a question of that.
Speaker B:Where things can get a little convoluted in Ghostbusters, but I just really appreciate Will Smith's humor is what it comes down to.
Speaker B:If he wasn't in the movie, would this have ever been.
Speaker B:Been on anyone's map?
Speaker B:Probably not.
Speaker B:I just like him.
Speaker B:I like him in fresh prints.
Speaker B:I like him in this even to extend in a horrible movie like Wild Wild west to some other things.
Speaker B:Like he's someone that'll get me to a screen more often than not.
Speaker B:And this was when he was close to, if not on his Mount Rushmore of movies like he was.
Speaker B:He was at the top of his game.
Speaker B:And his jokes still land when I watch and they're still funny.
Speaker B:And it's not to be anything bad to say against Ghostbusters.
Speaker B:I think there's a lot there I really mean.
Speaker B:Bill Murray's Bill Murray.
Speaker B:I just like the style of humor just a little bit more in Men in Black.
Speaker B:It feels closer to things that truly make me laugh in terms of tone.
Speaker B:I think Jay said it best.
Speaker B:Men in Black, you know what you're getting every time, like there's, there's no question, it doesn't deviate.
Speaker B:And there's power in that, that because there's so many movies we see that think they're a comedy, but then try to be a drama and then they're full, they're waffling, and you're like, all right, I need you to stay on brand.
Speaker B:I'm glad they did that.
Speaker B:But I, I do think Ghostbusters is a little bit more sophisticated and I think the ability to go from a little more dark to comedic is hard to do at times.
Speaker B:And I think they, they juggle that quite well.
Speaker B:But in how I normally rate this humor is most important to me in terms of what these movies are portraying.
Speaker B:And I think Ben A Black just slightly above.
Speaker B:Again.
Speaker C:For me, it comes down to like the different humor styles.
Speaker B:Right.
Speaker C:And once again, Ghostbusters kind of gets in its own way.
Speaker C:You have a very dry, sarcastic Bill Murray humor.
Speaker C:And I think if it's a duo, Bill Murray, Dan Aykroyd or Bill Murray, Rick Moranis or Bill Murray, Sigourney Weaver or Bill Murray and anybody else, it works.
Speaker C:But you have a little bit of conflicting humor styles that are coming in because like Rick Moranis is very good at being that kind of chameleon, but he's a much more active, over the top kind of humor and not the sarcastic, dry Bill Murray.
Speaker C:Whereas in Men in Black you have just witty banter and then Tommy Lee Jones is the quiet, stoic one with one liner zingers.
Speaker C:And you Have Will Smith, who is the kind of over the top, you know, companion for that, and it works much better.
Speaker C:They know what they're doing with that and they stick to that kind of humor.
Speaker C:Whereas Ghostbusters, a little bit of a hodgepodge.
Speaker C:So I'm gonna give him Men in Black.
Speaker B:All right, Alec, you're gonna kick us off on our last topic.
Speaker B:And maybe the easiest to rate or maybe the most difficult.
Speaker B:I'm curious.
Speaker B:We're gonna go to cultural impact and legacy.
Speaker C:Oh, it's easy.
Speaker C:Ghostbusters.
Speaker C:And it's not even close.
Speaker A:The.
Speaker C:The fact that you can play the Ghostbusters theme song, everybody jumps in, is enough of a reason that that has far more impact than Men in Black does.
Speaker B:I think.
Speaker B:I mean, I.
Speaker B:I don't disagree with you, but I think if you.
Speaker B:If there's two dudes wearing suits with.
Speaker B:With shades on, I definitely think Men in Black.
Speaker C:But you don't think Matrix Agent Smith.
Speaker B:No, Like, I have to.
Speaker B:I'd have to see the Morpheus glasses.
Speaker B:But that's.
Speaker B:That's a good point.
Speaker B:I don't know if I disagree with you, but what trumps it all is just the who are you going to call Ghostbusters song.
Speaker B:Like that.
Speaker B:There's that.
Speaker B:That got played at dances I went to growing up, and you didn't even have to know what the movie was.
Speaker B:You just knew that that was a song and people knew it and that.
Speaker B:That takes the cake.
Speaker B:But I think it's.
Speaker B:For me, it's an easy answer.
Speaker B:It's Ghostbusters.
Speaker B:They just.
Speaker B:It's something I've seen far more in merchandise, in pop culture comedic lore.
Speaker B:Who are you going to call?
Speaker B:Like, you say it, like, I don't know.
Speaker B:Just something that's been in my vocabulary from the beginning.
Speaker B:Men in Black, I think it was cool at the time and had some stylistic implications to how we dress and.
Speaker B:And think about aliens for a little bit.
Speaker B:But it was more of a flash in the pan, where I still think Ghostbusters to this day is something people.
Speaker B:You look at stranger things.
Speaker B:Like, it got brought back and revived, like, as of, like, five or six years ago.
Speaker B:And there was like a whole revival of the costumes and some of that lore again.
Speaker B:And they tried to bring Men in Black back with Chris Hemsworth and the other female actor.
Speaker B:I should know her name, but I can't say it right now.
Speaker B:I can't remember.
Speaker B:I don't know.
Speaker B:I didn't see any, like, oh, wow, Men in Black's back like this or that.
Speaker B:Like, Ghostbusters, like, definitely had some staying power and still does.
Speaker A:Yeah, I think that's a.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:I want to say it shouldn't be easy, but it is easy.
Speaker A:Ghostbusters for sure.
Speaker A:And that's finally not my biases talking like, it's.
Speaker A:Yeah, everybody knows Ghostbusters.
Speaker A:And I think what really separates this Matson, you kind of touched a little bit on it.
Speaker A:And that is, I think about Ghostbusters.
Speaker A:And outside of a like.
Speaker A:So Ghostbusters makes.
Speaker A:Does a remake that doesn't include the original cast with.
Speaker A:And they do the female version, whatever.
Speaker A:And they're all funny women, like.
Speaker A:But it didn't work.
Speaker A:It was terrible, actually.
Speaker A:Oh, funny enough.
Speaker A:Both of these I'm about to talk to.
Speaker A:You had Chris Hemsworth in them.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:When.
Speaker A:When Chris Hemsworth is the funniest part of your Ghostbusters movie, you up.
Speaker A:So it just didn't work.
Speaker A:But then you bring back and they do another remake, if you will, or sequel that then includes the characters very little, but includes them.
Speaker A:And it worked because you got back to the original themes and things like that.
Speaker A:Men in Black, outside of the first one.
Speaker A:And look, Men in Black 2's funny.
Speaker A:Men in Black 3 is funny.
Speaker A:Ish.
Speaker A:I.
Speaker A:I struggled.
Speaker A:But I'll tell you what I did like was what got me and surprised me was Josh Brolin SK in one of the later movies really worked for me.
Speaker A:Okay.
Speaker A:But the difference between the two is.
Speaker A:Is outside of the weird remake with.
Speaker A:Of Ghostbusters, Ghostbusters always works no matter how much.
Speaker A:Even Ghostbusters 2, it's an inferior movie to Ghostbusters 1, but it's really funny and it's really entertaining and it's good to watch.
Speaker A:And in some ways, it's scarier than the first one because the bad guy's really creepy.
Speaker A:And then the.
Speaker A:And then you have like, it disappears.
Speaker A:I mean, for 40 years, Ghostbusters has been around in some way, shape or form.
Speaker A:Slimer's so recognizable, it's ridiculous.
Speaker A:Like, you know all these things.
Speaker A:Whereas Men in Black, like, yes, people understand that.
Speaker A:But again, to Alex point, like, it can be confused if you're not holding like a Phase 4D atomizer in your hand.
Speaker A:You don't know what the hell you're talking about.
Speaker A:Like, it could be any movie with a guy in a suit and some glasses.
Speaker A:Right?
Speaker B:You need the little mind eraser.
Speaker B:But even then, people could still question.
Speaker B:But you got a little.
Speaker B:You got a backpack that looks like a vacuum with like a hose.
Speaker B:You hold it out or like a Little ghost symbol with the cross in it.
Speaker B:Everybody knows.
Speaker B:No.
Speaker A:Or the worst siren ever created.
Speaker A:The wee.
Speaker A:Like, yeah, you know what that is.
Speaker A:But to your point, like the song, man just will get you every time too.
Speaker A:And it's ironic because both have very recognizable theme songs, but if you were to add, like, play Men in Black for bunch of kids now, they wouldn't know, but I bet they know who you're gonna call.
Speaker B:So I, I, I think I disagree for the younger generation, but at least like, maybe like 20 and maybe like 25 and up, probably.
Speaker B:I, I'm gonna have to go ask my nieces and nephews tomorrow when they come over for the Super Bowl.
Speaker B:If the older ones I do know, they would know this, but I don't know if the other like 10 and below.
Speaker B:I doubt it.
Speaker A:I'd be curious if you were to.
Speaker B:Maybe the new movie, though.
Speaker B:Maybe the new movie though, because of that.
Speaker B:That's fair.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:I'd be, I'd be curious if you played both songs.
Speaker B:Oh, they definitely don't know man of Black.
Speaker B:Yeah, that, that I'm sure of.
Speaker B:Yeah, but like, maybe Ghostbusters.
Speaker A:Yeah.
Speaker A:Anyway.
Speaker A:But yeah, Ghostbusters takes that one for sure.
Speaker A:All right.
Speaker B:Well, we rolled through all five.
Speaker B:I think there was a bit of yo yoing, but I, I think Men in Black had more slight edging out than Ghostbusters.
Speaker B:But if maybe not, it was really close either way.
Speaker B:So I think we'll, we'll roll to our final ratings for the two movies.
Speaker B:I guess I'll go first because I picked both of these.
Speaker B:Whoa, man.
Speaker B:So tough.
Speaker B:I'm gonna get both a four.
Speaker B:I think they're both really solid, entertaining movies, but they are not without some of their, some of their wholesome things that we've talked about, I think.
Speaker B:Like Men in Black, for instance.
Speaker B:I love the chemistry.
Speaker B:I especially love Will Smith, but I don't think like the story overall.
Speaker B:It's, it's, it's a story that's told time and time again in Hollywood.
Speaker B:I don't think it's like, extremely compelling.
Speaker B:Um, or mo.
Speaker B:I don't know, emotional or heart.
Speaker B:Heartwarming is not the right thing, but it's just, it's generic to me.
Speaker B:But it's exceptional acting chemistry that makes it enjoyable.
Speaker B:I think Ghostbusters was an awesome premise and kind of revolutionary to extent with the practical and even visual effects.
Speaker B:I think there's some great chemistries we've talked about, but at times I think it can be its own worst enemy by trying to cram a little bit too much down your throat when it could have stayed slight, more simplistic.
Speaker B:It's entertaining.
Speaker B:I don't think it holds up as well in time in terms of the visuals, but it's abs.
Speaker B:If.
Speaker B:If you're listening to this and you haven't watched Ghostbusters, like, go watch the movie at least.
Speaker B:Like, please, please.
Speaker B:They're both really entertaining movies.
Speaker B:They are movies that I know I'll see both of them again with a probable slight preference to maybe Ghostbusters.
Speaker B:Because, like, we've talked about more people in my sphere of influence have seen that and enjoy that.
Speaker B:May the Men in Black.
Speaker B:But I really like both movies.
Speaker B:I think they did a good job.
Speaker A:Nice.
Speaker A:Alec, you go, buddy.
Speaker C:This is hard because I have trouble saying any one of these is like, a phenomenally good movie.
Speaker C:Like, they both kind of suck from a movie standpoint.
Speaker A:Get the out of here.
Speaker C:It's hard to be like, oh, yeah, this is a peak of, you know, cinema you're talking about.
Speaker C:Ghostbusters invented black.
Speaker C:So I think.
Speaker C:I think I'm gonna give both a three and a half.
Speaker C:And if I have to go, like, with a winner of Watch this movie over this movie, Ghostbusters, give it to Ghostbusters in the Edge.
Speaker C:But.
Speaker C:And that's.
Speaker C:That's just more.
Speaker C:If you watch Ghost.
Speaker C:If you haven't watched either one of these movies, which one are you gonna watch and be better off watching?
Speaker C:I think is Ghostbusters.
Speaker C:Yeah, three and a half for both of them.
Speaker B:But if they were in black and white, it probably would have been a four.
Speaker B:So just letting you know, black and.
Speaker C:White, they would have been five and a halfs.
Speaker A:It's good artistic choices at that point.
Speaker A:No, I am going to give Men in Black a four and I'm gonna give Ghostbusters a four and a half.
Speaker A:They're both great movies.
Speaker A:They both have flaws, I think.
Speaker A:I think for me, the perspective, like, when I watch him, like, I could watch Ghostbusters anytime, anywhere.
Speaker A:You say, let's load up and watch Ghostbusters, and I'm gonna laugh at the same jokes I've laughed at for 40 years.
Speaker A:Then, like, this man, dickless over here turned off the power grid.
Speaker A:Is this true?
Speaker A:Yes, it is true.
Speaker A:This man has no dick.
Speaker A:Like, what a great joke.
Speaker A:It's just.
Speaker A:And then he's like, to top it off, they break up the fight and he goes, what?
Speaker A:It's just.
Speaker A:What I heard.
Speaker A:Like, it's just.
Speaker A:And then.
Speaker A:But then there's jokes, like, you get a D series 4 DE atomizer and I get a midgie Cricket.
Speaker A:Are you kidding me?
Speaker A:Like, I feel like I'm gonna break this thing.
Speaker A:So it's.
Speaker A:They're both highly quotable.
Speaker A:But I think the difference for me is Ghostbusters.
Speaker A:Sit down and watch anytime, anywhere and have a good time.
Speaker A:Men in Black.
Speaker A:I don't think I could watch it that much.
Speaker A:Like I can watch it over and over because it's great, it's funny, it's got good jokes.
Speaker A:But I would get tired of it if I was consistently watching it.
Speaker A:I don't think I'd ever get tired of Ghostbusters.
Speaker A:I just think the comedy, the humor standard for me, Bill Murray will always peak.
Speaker A:Even though Will Smith's one of my favorite actors out there, he's not always one of my favorite comedians.
Speaker A:He's just so charismatic and he just steals every scene he's in.
Speaker A:And then you have Tommy Jones who actually hangs with them just really well.
Speaker A:So it was really good.
Speaker A:That worked out.
Speaker A:But Ghostbusters for me is just nostalgically probably one of my all time great movies that I could just watch anytime, anywhere, no questions asked, as many times as we wanted to watch it.
Speaker A:I love Ghostbusters, so it wins the battle.
Speaker A:But damn, it's a hard choice.
Speaker A:As much as they're different, they're similarities and, but they're just, they're both fun movies, good watches.
Speaker A:So yeah, there it is.
Speaker A:This is a fun one.
Speaker A:It was weird.
Speaker A:I wasn't expecting.
Speaker A:I was like.
Speaker A:When I first saw the list, I was like, really?
Speaker A:How do those two compare?
Speaker A:And then I watched them like, okay, we could talk about these.
Speaker A:This, this worked out so.
Speaker A:Great pick, Matson.
Speaker A:Great pick.
Speaker A:Even though I thought it was Alex pick for most of the.
Speaker B:Hey, you know me.
Speaker B:Even when I don't know that I picked it.
Speaker B:I'm doing the right thing.
Speaker A:Well played, sir.
Speaker A:Well played.
Speaker A:Well, Alec, tell everybody where they can find us.
Speaker C:Happy to.
Speaker C:Thank you for tuning into week two.
Speaker C:Right, yeah.
Speaker C:Week two of our arbitration series kind of makes sense.
Speaker C:We had two movies with two unforgettable teams, two unforgettable adventures.
Speaker C:Right.
Speaker C:So I guess this really comes down to whether you enjoy busting ghosts out of a firehouse that should have been condemned 60 years before or, you know, hunting down aliens with the neural.
Speaker C:What is that thing?
Speaker C:The Neura Neuralyzer Neural analyzer, something like that.
Speaker C:Whatever.
Speaker C:Kind of comes down to personal preference, where to find us.
Speaker C:Find us on YouTube where you can see our pretty faces as we are talking about movies or check us out on Patreon.
Speaker C:Special thanks to CB and Charles for selecting this clash of Titans, I guess we could say, you know.
Speaker C:So when it comes down to your movie podcasting needs, there's really only one question, and it's who you gonna call?
Speaker C:With that, I'll kick it back to the Titan of Terror, the King of crash.
Speaker A:A J.J.
Speaker A:yeah, appreciate that, Alec Man, I can't believe we didn't talk more about Vincent D'Onofrio, though, because Edgar is hilarious in this movie, but it's one of those first things.
Speaker A:He's so underrated until he was Kingpin and now he's huge.
Speaker A:But Vincent Onofro is no joke.
Speaker A:So anyway, with all that, as always, we appreciate you tuning in.
Speaker A:We'll catch you on the next one.
Speaker C:Baby.
Speaker A:Cinematic.
